CANUSA Gas....

BOSS

BOSS

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Oct 31, 2002
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OK... so I understand the world economic of rising gasoline prices, and use by countries like China affecting local prices...

What I don't understand, is why can't the USA and Canada remove themselves from the world pipeline and produce and retain our own supply. One would assume, that if we produce it here, that we would be able to lower and control the price and also remove the world influence that affects prices here...

I just don;t get that part.... Doug?
 
most oil companies are multinational. here are the top 11

1. Royal Dutch Shell - Netherlands
2. BP - UK
3. Gazprom - Russia
4. ExxonMobil -US (mainly natural gas, not so much petro)
5. Petrobras - Brasil
6. Total - France
7. PetroChina - China
8. Chevron - usa
9. ENI - Italy
10. ConocoPhillips - usa
11. Sinopec China


Most of the USA companies are hauling in their $$ from development contracts with foreign countries such as Qatar, Brazil, not so much here in the US. So there is no allegiance toward North America and keeping oil here. Selling to the highest bidder = profits, and that is.. the name of the game... For all of us.
 
When PetroCan was formed,and nationalized in the 70's by our illustrious Liberal government, under Trudeau, this was EXACTLY what was supposed to happen! During the formative years of infrastructure, and development, in Alberta AND Saskatchewan, and the formation of SunCor, that spelled doom for the self reliance idea of North American supply and demand..it was "supposed" to be a co-operative effort, and led to a "free trade" agreement between Canada,the US, and Mexico, that was "supposed to" protect us from the world economy...it included ALL natural resources, steel,lumber, petroleum,copper, coal, natural gas, etc., but, did NOT "explain" how the system was to be self enforced.
The US destroyed the integrity of this agreement...almost from it's onset, with a "protectionist" bowshot, over lumber and steel, and almost immediately destroyed the bi-lateral trust, that we all had agreed upon.
Our US cousins don't want our "dirty oil"....that's OK...we'll find a way,and a customer(s), our US cousins don't want our steel in their pipelines, that's OK, we'll find a way, and a customer(s), our US cousins WILL NOT ADMIT, that our lumber is priced fairly, and without unfair competition subsidies, so, we'll find a way, and a customer(s).......so much for free trade, so much for shaking on it, so much for written agreements, so much for trust!
 
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1) Global oil demand is roughly where it was in 2005- 2006.
2) Global oil supply is roughly where it was in 2005 - 2006.
3) USA consumes 24-25% of daily global oil demand. USA has approx 5% of the global population.
4) Known oil reserves (as measured on a reserves/production ratio) in the USA should last 10 years.
5) Known oil reserves (measured as in #4 above) in the GGC countries (Saudia Arabia, Kuwait, Bahrain, Qatar, U.A.E. and Oman) + Iraq + Iran should last 560 + years. Venezuela's reserves, around 380 years. Canada has reserves for approx 180 years. Clearly, we're not going to run out of oil anytime soon. .
6) Supply & demand are not a real factor in the price of oil.
7) Factors on oil price are :
- geopolitics....Obama only speaking a an hour or so ago how there is ample oil production capacity as not to effect the West Texas and Brent -the general market benchmarks for pricing crude- pricing;
- the cost of exploration, extraction and refining is a key factor and many in the industry say that a field is not worth developing with West Texas under US$70+; and
- speculation....free market = speculation...doing it this year on 2 key factors - Iran and assumed nuclear weapon development and on the lack of, in the US (the consumer of 24-25% of the finished product), refining capacity and that this will last throughout the summmer ...see attached Bloomberg link.
8) Oh, and oil prices are NOT where they were in 2005 - 2006.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-...-as-refinery-outages-crimp-summer-supply.html
 
Can't we all just get along????

Thanks for the education folks!
 
BOSS said:
Can't we all just get along????

Thanks for the education folks!
Click to expand...
I "jog" best, when it's my "memory" doing it.....:)
Oh how I'd like to poke some of them politicians in the eye, so us ordinary folks can just git er done!
 
Mikey the Flower Guy said:
I "jog" best, when it's my "memory" doing it.....:)
Oh how I'd like to poke some of them politicians in the eye, so us ordinary folks can just git er done!
Click to expand...

and kick them in their big fat seats... and a little 2x4 mentality - that's a better jog btw. :)
 
This comes from a retired oil executive who spent some 40 years in the industry.
Mass Exodus US Oil Refineries.

The Closure Of The U.S. Oil Refinery Industry In The Past 2 Years
In 2010, there were 149 operable U.S. refineries with a combined capacity of 17.6 million barrels (2,800,000 m3) per day. Something odd started happening in late 2010-early 2011. The US oil refinery industry quietly announced the closure of numerous US oil refineries. Many are completely unaware the US ships oil overseas to be processed. We do so, as we do not have enough refineries to process the vast amounts here, and, we are barred from building anymore refineries. All refineries perform three basic steps: separation, conversion, and treatment. Pretty simple.
Several reasons include technical and economic factors as to why we ship it overseas to be processed.
1.. The crude petroleum is sold to the highest bidder, NOT the nearest bidder
2.. There are different kinds of crude oil, such as sweet/light and dark/heavy. They have different applications and uses.
3.. Different kinds of refining processes are needed to make different products from the crude oil. Petroleum is processed to make lots of products other than gasoline, like plastics and asphalt.
4.. Politics, unions and the "environmentalists"
How many of you are aware Sunoco, ConocoPhillips and The HESS Corp are all closing US oil refineries? Not many, as the media refuses to give this HUGE story coverage. My guess is that if Americans understood the complete truth to how we are being sold out, and enslaved there just might be the much needed revolution to turn this country around.
Last September, both Sunoco & COP announced plant closing, effecting thousands of workers. Sunoco announced they are completely getting out of the oil industry. Closing up shop. They are done with the US oil industry.
Sunoco is closing it's 2 oil refineries in July 2012 in Philadelphia and Marcus Hook, Pa. Those 2 facilities alone process over 500,000 barrels a day.
http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=news/local&id=8343372
Also last year, ConocoPhillips announced 2 plant closings for sure in Trainer, PA and Bayway, NJ., the other 3 plants are undecided as of today.
http://stillwaterassociates.com/ind...-whos-buying&catid=40:white-papers&Itemid=155
Conoco also announced they were closing their Alaskan refining facility:
http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2011/09/28/news/doc4e828f2ba723a246763254.txt
Just a week ago, the US 3rd largest oil refinery owned and operated by The HESS Corp just announced it's permanent closure. Costing over 2,000 jobs, and affecting 950 contractors:
http://www.tucsonnewsnow.com/story/16543753/major-oil-refinery-to-close-in-us-virgin-islands
Refineries on the East Coast of the US supply 40% of the gasoline sales and 60% of the diesel and other fuel oils.
Of that, HALF that comes from the Sunoco & ConocoPhillips plant closures.
When ConocoPhillips announced that it was closing the Trainer refinery, Willie Chiang, then ConocoPhillips' Senior Vice President of Refining, Marketing, Transportation and Commercial, noted that their decision to sell, like Sunoco's, was based on unfavorable economics caused by a competitive and difficult market environment characterized by "...product imports, weakness in motor fuel demand, and costly regulatory requirements."
They are ALL closing up shop due to gov regulations, union demands and excessive operating costs brought on by the Gov regulations.
Then you have the unions, led by Barry's buddy, Leo Gerard, saying they will close ALL US oil refineries starting from the east coast to west coast today.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/09/23/usa-oil-refinery-labor-idUSS1E78M0T620110923
The unions are shutting down ports, rail and air across the pond right now......the SAME EXACT thing they plan on doing here. When the ships stop importing, the rails & air stop delivering....how much is everything you consume going to cost? Remember...we are a CONSUMING country, no longer a producing one.
http://www.hellenicshippingnews.com/News.aspx?ElementId=37873cee-2b75-4aa0-86ac-5336e56a4c04
The excessive and costly gov regulations on the US oil refinery market has forced companies to re-evaluate the cost of doing business in the US ..
Why have operations in the US where you bleed money via regulations & demands, when you can have refineries built in Columbia , Mexico or Brazil for pennies on the dollar, and less regulations?
It's all business America ...nothing personal.
Besides.....your gov is giving BILLIONS to Columbia and Brazil to build refineries to process all that oil the US is losing.
We are building up every country on earth, while destroying our own....all in the name of redistribution of wealth.
I covered some of these "deals" Barry inked in my previous note:
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100003192895784&sk=notes#!/note.php?note_id=145148522268243
You do the math. When the US oil refineries finally close up shop, who will process all that oil....and how much do YOU think that oil will cost when it's ALL processed over seas?
Think gas and energy costs are high right now.......wait 6 months. You haven't seen anything yet.
How can anyone expect any company to do business with an anti-American, hostile gov out of control? You can't. That is why we are seeing a mass exodus, across the board in every industry in the US LEAVING.
 
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Clay,

Thank you for a very interesting post. Some in southern NJ are aware of the lower, domestic, refining capacity - the Sunoco closures are effecting the economics in this area (inc. the far south-eastern corner of PA and the Wilmington/Newark parts of DE) as many of the lost jobs were average to good $ levels.

As you know a great deal on the refining level, with a barrel of crude = 42 US gallons/159 liters, how much of that is used for vehicle gasoline and how much for aviation fuel?

Simon
 
Clay, thanks for a great read...

And folks told me a year and two ago, I was foolish for stockpiling ammunition... I don't think so... my only fear is that I'll get a chance to use it... sooner than later.
 
I was talking to a person that did some engineer work for a refinery plant in California. The plant was built in the 60's/70's, but if they make any repairs/additions to the plant.....that the air coming out of the plant, has to be CLEANER that the California air going in.

If I remember right, there has not been a new full blown refinery built since the 70's.....but look at how many more vehicles are on the road since then. So, we do not have enough refinereries, the refineriers can not afford to make any updates.....and if the Orange/Port Aurther Texas area gets a direct hit of a hurricane (where there is a large concentration of the pre-70's refineries), then us Americans are going to be *u*c*ed.

Why don't we use the some of the BILLIONS that the taxpayers have been paying for the all the layers of Bureaucracy of the Department Of Energy......remember, that was put together to help us on keep our dependency of foreign oil down.
 
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