FTD 2% Bloomnet TAX

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BOSS

BOSS

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Oct 31, 2002
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We are all aware of FTD's new plan to try and stiffle 800Flowers ability to get their orders filled....while in reality it is an attempt by FTD to garner more dollars...in their words:

If a florist is willing to pay 800Flowers 9%, then they should be willing to pay us the same.... (off the record of course)...

HERE you can read an article that explains a bunch of it, and has links to Department of Justice litigation, as well as some other interesting articles.
 
comparing numbers

BOSS, sorry to admit it, but I really don't understand the numbers in that report. If 1-800 is reporting 300M in revenue in floral gift business, does anyone have any idea, how much of that is florist related and how much is drop ship gift business? I assume that number includes all revenue from gourmet foods, wines, flowers in a box and revenue figures from the new companies recently purchased. If all these florists currently joining bloomnet to get a "piece of the pie", they may find that the pie is not as large as they originally thought.
 
Griff, I have to agree especially after polling my Fed Ex guy at Christmas time. He stated few fresh flowers from 800Flowers but loads of small dropship stuff. ProFlowers had most of the fresh dropship.
With 800's prominent pages being 85% drop ship, I'd want a breakdown also. (if I was thinking I'd be getting beaucoup bucks by joining)
 
Re: What about their new AAA 20% Discount?

With their NEW BETTER plan to drive customers into LOCAL FLOWER SHOPS, all ya have TO DOO is sign up and agree to give 20% off to the AAA Members.

Seems TOO MEE that, the only thing they're able TOO DOO these days is to either HELP YOU GIVE YOUR STUFF AWAY or HELP THEM TAKE YOUR STUFF AWAY!

As I've always said: " If I want to GIVE MY STUFF AWAY, all I have to do is to stand outside my own shop, and GIVE IT ALL AWAY. Then, I get all the KUDOS and ACCOLADES rather than SOMEONE ELSE!
 
Interesting numbers

Thanks, Cathy. 300M in flowers and 300M in gifts. Now all these potential bloomnet florists have to figure out is how much of that 300M goes to their designated filling centers and how much is left to split between the remaining 6,000 florists.
 
Griff said:
Now all these potential bloomnet florists have to figure out is how much of that 300M goes to their designated filling centers .
Click to expand...
In markets with LFC's the number I was told was roughly 85% to the LFC and the balance to their members (gotta keep them happy remember).

Each LFC negotiates their individual contarct, and when a new LFC opens it does not automatically get the volume. Perhaps 45-55% the first year until proven, then it is increased in increments in bi-annual contract re-negotiations.

LFC's are now stocking much of the "hard good, gift items" and doing much of the direct ship packaging and distribution. This is done to cut days off shipping, having the regional LFC's send it from several location, while 800F can continue to collect the same flat rate shipping fee, thus making shipping a profit center.

The LFC's get the same percentages on direct ship items, with obviously much less work involved...however they also have to buy the items from 800F in the first place....they look at it as low cost/low return and it's all made up on volume.
 
flowerknife+us said:
Is it because of all these 'tricks" that order filler and Fulliment havn't been heard from lately?
Click to expand...

Could be... not sure who *order filler* is, but I have a pretty good idea who *Fullfilment* is....
 
BOSS said:
Could be... not sure who *order filler* is, but I have a pretty good idea who *Fullfilment* is....
Click to expand...

Inquiring minds want to know.

I was refering to the one telling me there was a fulliment operation setting up arround here.

No signs of them yet. I was supposed to be "sweating" about their arrival befor Christmass.

Personally, I don't see the numbers comming through our Delivery coop to justify the hype. If anything, the volume has shown a decrease over the years.

Current known fillers show weak numbers.

Their not there, or they are really getting spread arround.

The economy has not been good for several years and everybody under the sun is selling flowers. Many younger people have been moving away.

Converson and order manipulation.
 
Please understand....

Mr C, none of us are real authorities on what 1-800 is doing in various areas of the country, but I can give a little insight for around here.

In the beginning, various florists in the Chicago area were designated 1-800 fillers. Some were in the Chicago delivery pool. Eventually 1-800 got enough customer data to set up an independent "fulfillment center". My undertanding is that several of the original fillers on still filling for them, but now only get the same day orders that are too late for the fulfillment center to handle. Delivery is done through a contractor with 1-800 designations on the trucks. I see them out here maybe once a week. The center is approx. 25-30 away. Once they have a historical data base of recepients, they can go find someone who is willing to be a "fulfillment center". That data base will also include all the gifts they have drop shipped. This is the same concept they used when they originally went out to florists and tried to get them as 1-800 florists by guaranteeing X numbers of orders per year for a specific area.

Rockford is the second largest city in Illinois and 1-800 has at least 2 florists that I know of serving as fillers for flowers only in that area. There are some designated florists in the surrounding rural areas also designated for large delivery areas. I can only assume that if the data collected ever shows that order volumn will support a facility of their own, 1-800 will do that area too. For now they seem to only be concentrating on the 50+ major markets and using gullible florists for the rest.

Syracuse may or may not be on their " blib" screen yet, but it most likely because they have other areas with higher piorities at this moment. Trust me, if they think their is sufficient business there, they will appear sooner or later.
 
I am only wondering aloud about any long term potential in doing this type operation knowing as soon as you "make it" they "take it".

To any one starting one up. The Initinal infusion of orders need to come from somewhere. It's not like there is this great surge of unfilled orders to send.

So who ever does the work now gets it stuck to them. Some partner to hook up with.

Chicago is a big place. So the numbers should work out. But if I were doing the work and found my self having it sucked directly to the company. Any other order from them would have taken a fast ride through cyber space.
 
Yes, Mr C, I agree with you.It doesn't make sense why florists continue to get sucked into these deals, but they do.

I was told along time ago, that if you starve a dog long enough, it will eat anything. If a stranger feeds a dog, that dog will follow the stranger anywhere to get more food. I think that's what is happening in this industry. Florists are willing to do ANYTHING to have someone feed them orders. It is just my own opinion, but I think this goes back to the beginning of this industry. If you wanted to be a florist, all you had to do was hang our a sign, FLORIST, and put an ad in the local yellow pages and people would come to your shop. They knew what to expect from anyone calling themselves florists. It doesn't work that way anymore.

And being a 1-800 filler doesn't neccessarily work for florists even in large cities like Chicago anymore. Remember, 1-800 had to GUARANTEE x numbers of orders to their designated fullfillment center first to get them on board. Only the overflow and late orders are passed on to the other florists and then those orders are only for close zip codes because it's too late for delivery pools.

But no matter how much we talk about how the game is being played these days and who is playing it, we still have florists willing to stand in line like starving dogs wanting to be feed.
 
Griff said:
And being a 1-800 filler doesn't neccessarily work for florists even in large cities like Chicago anymore. Remember, 1-800 had to GUARANTEE x numbers of orders to their designated fullfillment center first to get them on board. Only the overflow and late orders are passed on to the other florists and then those orders are only for close zip codes because it's too late for delivery pools.

But no matter how much we talk about how the game is being played these days and who is playing it, we still have florists willing to stand in line like starving dogs wanting to be feed.
Click to expand...

Sooo true. Up until Jan 1st, we were a filler for 800, and quite frankly, we should have been out long before. (Filled for them for 8 years....2006 would have been #9)

Up until about 2 years ago, it WAS profitable to be a filler for 800. Between the volume you got, the simplistic designs, and LOW Bloomnet fees, you COULD generate a profit. However, with the advent of Bloomnet as a WIRE SERVICE, BLM's ever increasing fees (they nickel & dime you to death) and the push to sign up as many shops as poss, you CAN NOT make ANY money filling orders for 800. TRUST ME when I say we USED to make some serious $$$. Like 25-30 orders a DAY. Mostly all mass-production work. I hired $7-$8 hour designers, overseen by a good design manager and boom - out they went. Now, we were averaging 4 orders a day. Not worth it.

Also, GRIFF is correct that there are too many florists who are willing to fill the orders...they do not do the math! Some of these shops were SHOCKED that we dropped 800. I had to mathematically show them it doesn't pay unless you do a LOT of volume. And, in TODAY's market, I'm not so sure that model works.
...especially when the volume of orders is watered down so much b/t the LFC's and new Bloomnet shops....

- H.
 
I hate 800 Flowers, most of their designs plain out stink for those of us who have to pay bigger bucks for the trucks to bring our flowers. BUT one wholesaler carries the stupid birthday cake oasis tray kit, so I bought two just to see how they work. I usually refuse the dang things and got one in last week after buying the "kit" (with an 800Flowers care tag which went into the trash). Before you bi**h..I take the orders that go to MY customers, my good customers for over 30 years. With my disclaimer!
She absolutely loved that stupid cake, even stopped in yesterday to say how sweet it still was. Yes she is 70 something but a great "mouthpiece" and loved by many a townspeople here. I just know that I will definitely ask for at least $10 more next time as their kit is much larger than I have done before or will make to "my size" next time.
 
Hate to say it...

...but those goofy flower cakes sell. So much so, it's a stock item in our coolers... We buy the foam from Syndicate...
Sell for $39.99 plus delivery of course (800 sells them for 39.99 TOTAL - then less the 29 %...)

- H.
 
If one gets raked for a few and connot recieve enough to make it profitable on it's own. Then why one does them at all is beyond me.

If all these companys competiting with us want to convert more to direct ship. We should really just let them have it.

Just deny them everything else.

Use the wire service of choise if need be, to serve your own personal need for transmitting orders. Maintain and improve upon the bonds florists have to serve one anothers intrests.

You may never be able to address the 20/80 split to everyones satisfaction. You can, however, return it to some level of sanity where it at least servces our intrests.

You can't have "Florists Quality" with out a Florist.

Where can any of these companys go if they can't recieve "Florist" services within their own Company?

I'd rather see 1000 florists tell them to all take a HIKE than to Guarentee what may be someone elses poor product.

Poor service will hit them right where it hurts.

Wasn't the Pide Pipers job to get rid of the Rats, not the Florists?

Direct ship is not for all people nor for all ocassions.
 
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