Stockton CA, Foreclosure Capital

[MANORVILLE]

60 Minutes refers to Stockton as the Ground Zero of the current
financial crisis.
Foreclosure capital of America !

 

[lori042499]

60 Minutes refers to Stockton as the Ground Zero of the current
financial crisis.
Foreclosure capital of America !

OOOhhh! I watched that last night...what a mess. All those dots in one city. I am very,very scared of all of that....I really think that the banks need to be regulated. There are way too mnay people that do not, cannot and will not bother to understand what they are suigning on to and the banks definately do not disclose enough of the info to people. Our children should be taught a class in finances and the ills of credit. They should also b taught about finance charges, interest rates and what it all means to buy before you have the cash...My generation should be known as the upside down generation because we are upside down on mortgages, cars and just about anything we have. We don't fix anything, we just go out and buy new.....bad, bad, bad..

 

[sfox]

My only questions

OOOhhh! I watched that last night...what a mess. All those dots in one city. I am very,very scared of all of that....I really think that the banks need to be regulated. There are way too mnay people that do not, cannot and will not bother to understand what they are suigning on to and the banks definately do not disclose enough of the info to people. Our children should be taught a class in finances and the ills of credit. They should also b taught about finance charges, interest rates and what it all means to buy before you have the cash...My generation should be known as the upside down generation because we are upside down on mortgages, cars and just about anything we have. We don't fix anything, we just go out and buy new.....bad, bad, bad..

For most Americans, I think buying a house is the single largest purchase most will make. Don't you think that the individual should be responsible for their actions?

Why are the banks fault? Why is it the mortgage brokers fault? Why is it the realtors fault? Everyone I mentioned is in business to make money. I don't think you can find a single case where the person who was planning to buy a home was denied access to a lawyer or a CPA in order to get expert consultation. If they were not smart enough to undertsand all the fine print or didn't understand how a particular mortgage worked, why DIDN'T THEY seek guidance? The govenment can't protect people from themselves.

And those people, who were in business to make money, shouldn't be held responsible for the errors in judgement of others. In our shop, we have a special most of the year, where you can get 2 dozen roses vased for $1.00 more than the price of one dozen. I can't tell you how make times, a customer has turned down the special and only wants to purchase one dozen roses instead of two. If afterwards, the customer figures out that he paid more then he could have do I have any responsiblily to him?

The average person got caught up in the greed of the time. They weren't interested if the mortgage lender fudged the amount of their income, because they felt in got them what they wanted. Now after the bubble burst, those same people are crying because now they are stuck. If the bubble had not burst, do you really think that those same people would be running to the government to tell them to investigate.

 

[lori042499]

For most Americans, I think buying a house is the single largest purchase most will make. Don't you think that the individual should be responsible for their actions?

Why are the banks fault? Why is it the mortgage brokers fault? Why is it the realtors fault? Everyone I mentioned is in business to make money. I don't think you can find a single case where the person who was planning to buy a home was denied access to a lawyer or a CPA in order to get expert consultation. If they were not smart enough to undertsand all the fine print or didn't understand how a particular mortgage worked, why DIDN'T THEY seek guidance? The govenment can't protect people from themselves.

And those people, who were in business to make money, shouldn't be held responsible for the errors in judgement of others. In our shop, we have a special most of the year, where you can get 2 dozen roses vased for $1.00 more than the price of one dozen. I can't tell you how make times, a customer has turned down the special and only wants to purchase one dozen roses instead of two. If afterwards, the customer figures out that he paid more then he could have do I have any responsiblily to him?

The average person got caught up in the greed of the time. They weren't interested if the mortgage lender fudged the amount of their income, because they felt in got them what they wanted. Now after the bubble burst, those same people are crying because now they are stuck. If the bubble had not burst, do you really think that those same people would be running to the government to tell them to investigate.

All people have a dream of owning a home, but not all people are created equal in the area of brains. many people are being lead throught the home buying experience without a clue as to what it all means. I can see how an inexperienced and maybe not so brilliant person could get very lost in the shuffle of buying a home and sign away without knowing exactly what they are signing, not smart but many people sign contracts without reading them trusting that they have been told all the very important things it contains because they cannot read the legal jargon. A great many of them sign without even knowing they can or should have a lawyer read it. They are coaxed into believing that the mortgage people have their best interest at heart whe in fact they don't. I believe that the banks take advantage of people's inability to read the fine print everyday and they make up new rules regarding financing creatively everyday to make up newer and more harsh fees and rules. It has got to stop. I just believe that kids would be better off knowing that 20,000.00 of debt paid off 30 bucks at a time will take the 40 years to pay off at such and such an interest rate that knowing that x + 8(c-4)=48 or the hypotnuse of an angle....that is all.

 

[bloomz]

I don't see wanting a home for your family as greed.

I also feel a great deal of compassion for the people that are losing their homes.

If the lender fudged anything - it's their business and their fault and they should be brought to task for irresponsible lending.

 

[MANORVILLE]

I don't see wanting a home for your family as greed.

I also feel a great deal of compassion for the people that are losing their homes.

If the lender fudged anything - it's their business and their fault and they should be brought to task for irresponsible lending.

Gotta look at the bigger picture sfox.
Forget about the house and mortgage for a sec.
How about the dramatic rise in costs across the board which have depleted the pockets of many that otherwise may have been able to survive.

Fuel Oil NY median $3.50 per gal / $962.25 plus for a 275 gal. fill up
Times that by 3 or 4 or more.
Gas and diesel $ 3.23 to $3.81 per
Electric in Long Island Fogettaboutit
etc....etc....etc......etc......
and lets not forget that everything else went up and or got surcharged.

Moral:
Maybe when they tried to grab a piece of the American Dream, to have a life and raise a family they could pull it off !
Now because of needless and senseless BS which is crippling the greatest country in the world, ( cause the big boys have to feed the need, and their wallets/purses ), their dream is a nightmare.
Are they at fault, for dreaming, working, hoping for a better life ?
Heck no !

Bloomz mentions compassion !
Hey Bloomzie.........right there with ya bud !

Everywhere ya look the indications are present.....we are self destructing !
We can't take care of our own people, our own soldiers, and our own backyards.
Pretty sad state of affairs.

Nuff said.......bad subject for me to get too involved with !
Some of us understand what Sempre Fidelis means, and live every day of our lives trying to protect and safeguard a dream, a country and a way of life for our people.
Some will never understand !


LORI

Good posts !

 

[sfox]

Sorry Manorville

Manorville posted "Gotta look at the bigger picture sfox.
Forget about the house and mortgage for a sec.
How about the dramatic rise in costs across the board which have depleted the pockets of many that otherwise may have been able to survive."

I am looking at the bigger picture. What do you tell the guy that did his homework? He didn't try to stretch and buy over his head. He got professional advice when getting his mortgage. His house has fallen in value, but since he did his homework he is not in danger of losing it. But he is watching his money disappear in spite of all his hard work. Now you ask him to help bail out those who didn't do anything right.

And as far as grabbing a piece of the American dream, I all for it. But I don't want to have to pay for the other guy.

I know I am not alone. So why should people who live their life in a sensible manner have to pay for the folly of the others.

And hey bloomz, since you feel they should be saved, use your money to help them. I could ask President Bush to place a special tax on flower shops in the state of Washington, and the money will be used to stop foreclosures. You should be all for that right? You are all about helping the other guy or at least you post that way.

 

[prestonway]

And hey bloomz, since you feel they should be saved, use your money to help them. I could ask President Bush to place a special tax on flower shops in the state of Washington, and the money will be used to stop foreclosures. You should be all for that right? You are all about helping the other guy or at least you post that way.

Jon probably would be all in favor...considering he's in Oregon...:sblush::sblush:

 

[bloomz]

And hey bloomz, since you feel they should be saved, use your money to help them. I could ask President Bush to place a special tax on flower shops in the state of Washington, and the money will be used to stop foreclosures. You should be all for that right? You are all about helping the other guy or at least you post that way.

You talk to him? Tell him I said hey, willya? Hope he can hurry up back to Crawford and ask him if there's anything I can do to help.

Preston's right - I'm all for higher taxes in Washington - DC especially.

Is compassion stricly a liberal term, qulaity, or state of mind? Fox you seem to have been absent the day they handed it out. 's ok - I must have gotten your share.

But speaking of GREED - I would prefer if they taxed the greedy bastard oil companies tho...

But since Dumbo is the one that set them up for record profits while everyone else is struggling - AND they're his butt bros - I think it's gonna take a Democrat to pull that off.

While they're at it - I wonder if they can make Haliburton accountable for their GREED.

Stay tuned.

And on that topic - I'll gladly pay higher taxes if I get my health insurance costs (tripled during the Dumbo years) reduced.

You heard it right - bloomz is for higher taxes and more benefits. And I don't mean Free Government Cheese.

C'mon Exxon - share the wealth you greedily porked us all off for.

 

[MANORVILLE]

It's ok sfox Debate is as American as it gets !

Hey sfox, opinions are good, you know it !
Let me throw a little more out there:

Manorville posted "Gotta look at the bigger picture sfox.
Forget about the house and mortgage for a sec.
How about the dramatic rise in costs across the board which have depleted the pockets of many that otherwise may have been able to survive."

"I am looking at the bigger picture. What do you tell the guy that did his homework? He didn't try to stretch and buy over his head. He got professional advice when getting his mortgage. His house has fallen in value, but since he did his homework he is not in danger of losing it. But he is watching his money disappear in spite of all his hard work. Now you ask him to help bail out those who didn't do anything right." sfox

Doing your homework...pre-purchase:

OK, did the homework, had a pro beside us, purchased well within our means based upon current revenue and economic trends.
Shouldn't be a problem according to your thoughts on the subject correct ? No fudging of the numbers either !

Wrong !

Example property value down 113,000.00 since it all began. Current sell price well under what it would take to satisfy the note. Economy is in the pooper with no sign of recovery, even if the Fed drops the rate 2 points Wednesday. General recovery 8 months to 2 years, with Housing recovery at best 3 to 4 years.

Now everything imaginable is up in price, you take on additional clients, consult your favorite analyst and the original adviser who steered you in the RIGHT direction when you purchased.
Both tell you to hold. You do and 5 months later you learn that the property value is now down 153,000.00.
You and the wife waited 7 years to get stable and secure enough to start a family. Got all the bases covered, but now, you are totally screwed.
So making all the right moves really doesn't mean all that much because the effect of this economy has not just targeted the dummies that played with the numbers and got in above their means.


And as far as grabbing a piece of the American dream, I all for it. But I don't want to have to pay for the other guy.

I believe ya on this, and I don't want to pay for the other guy either.
Whattya think I'm nuts ? Wait....don't answer that...let's move on !

If in fact I have to pay for something I would gladly kick in the bucks to preserve the dream, " for our people ", as opposed to everywhere else our hard earned tax dollars are sent to.
We fund the entire world sfox and we're going to allow what is ours to be brought down in destruction, because we're so over extended and greedy that we don't care anymore ?
This is still America right ?
We'll fight the OG's and WS but won't stand up for our own people ?
No way !

Problem is we have become accustomed to the BS and therefore accept it as we feel there is no way to change it. As a result we turn a deaf ear to the reality of the dilemmas faced by our own people.
It's easier to whine and cry before even entering the battlefield.
( Not directed at you sfox ).
What did Gibson/William Wallace say in Braveheart ?
Something to the effect of.........Would you not at least like to enter the battlefield before you turn tail and run ?


I know I am not alone. So why should people who live their life in a sensible manner have to pay for the folly of the others.

Living life in a sensible manner:

You are definitely not alone there sfox.
So, people that live sensibly by appropriate and accepted standards
should be exempt from the pitfalls of a country in utter turmoil, yes turmoil !
What is the formula for living life in a sensible manner ?
Does anyone here not know someone, at least one person, couple or family that did it all right, to the best of their ability, yet couldn't get to that secure place in life so they could pursue what many of us are fortunate to have ?
At a community meeting here with 134 attendees that all own 400,000 to 900,000 homes, the general consensus was bleak, with almost half, who live sensibly and modestly, citing financial troubles including mortgage difficulties.


And hey bloomz, since you feel they should be saved, use your money to help them. I could ask President Bush to place a special tax on flower shops in the state of Washington, and the money will be used to stop foreclosures. You should be all for that right? You are all about helping the other guy or at least you post that way.

Great Idea ! Cmon Bloomzie !


Now I'm reaching here, but I'm curious .
We want to stay in business right, that's why we're in the game and discussing the state of affairs, in addition to shop talk, everyday at FC.
Here are a few questions off the top of my head :

Do any of you care to loose the business of the working man and woman that comprise....... how much of the U.S. workforce ?, ........and how much of our annual revenue ?
I don't !

Do any of you believe that we should continue to support foreign interests before we support our own people ?
I doubt it !

Does anyone know of anyone, that has lost a friend or loved one in defense of our American Dream ?
No doubt I'm sure !

I've seen it, I've felt it and have served those whose lives have been devastated, in defense of the American Dream.
Body Bags suck, more so if you know who's in one.
The only thing that sucks more is being with the kids that have lost out for what equates to nothing !


By the way sfox, the guy that did his homework was me in the beginning of my post. 25 years, 17 properties, 5 businesses that were sold at a profit and still living life in a sensible manner, well within my means, but I still got bit. Tis one of the reasons why I can relate, and have compassion. The only thing I colored in the story was the wife and family. Borrowed that from a good friend of mine.

Paid Meola to take the ex wife off my hands and heard she got drop shipped! LOL

Losing my steam so time to wind this lengthy post down.


Kudos sfox for standing by what you believe in.

Kevin

 

[bloomz]

A man who'll stand by his convictions - even after they've been proven wrong.

takes a certain kind of "mettle".

this is why the Fox loves Presidunce Boosch so much.

 

[Sher]

I feel that all of you have good points about the story last night but what really got me was when the reporter mentioned that some of those folks in the story got additional money at the closing...like 60 grand....because they were given that money by the banks ...and yet these same folks can put that into their bankruptcy and walk...somehow, coming from a generation that had parents that never walked away from debt, that one was hard for me to swallow. At some point there is personal accountability. Or needs to be. And much of it does belong in the abnks lap..cripes at one point if you could breathe into a glass and leave moisture, you could qualify beyond what you could pay...that is not the buyers fault..that lies down right on front of the lenders.
Sher

 

[MANORVILLE]

Strong Point

I feel that all of you have good points about the story last night but what really got me was when the reporter mentioned that some of those folks in the story got additional money at the closing...like 60 grand....because they were given that money by the banks ...and yet these same folks can put that into their bankruptcy and walk...somehow, coming from a generation that had parents that never walked away from debt, that one was hard for me to swallow. At some point there is personal accountability. Or needs to be. And much of it does belong in the abnks lap..cripes at one point if you could breathe into a glass and leave moisture, you could qualify beyond what you could pay...that is not the buyers fault..that lies down right on front of the lenders.
Sher

********************************************************
.......somehow, coming from a generation that had parents that never walked away from debt, that one was hard for me to swallow.
********************************************************

Had to quote that again.

Those that abuse the system should not get a free ride.
Those that did it right deserve the support of their country.
I don't want to pay for the freeloaders but I can't turn my back on those that are trying to do it right.

Great post Sher


Kevin

 

[sfox]

You are so blind

A man who'll stand by his convictions - even after they've been proven wrong.

takes a certain kind of "mettle".

this is why the Fox loves Presidunce Boosch so much.

JON, because you believe so much in the Democrats you are blind to any other ideas. Personally, I really don't care who gets in because I have lived long enough to know that I personally will see nothing.

First, let me say I am part of the middle class. In the past when the Democrats were in office, they talked about helping the middleclass back then too. And everytime they passed some new legislation to help the middle class, it always seemed that my middle class earnings were always classified as being rich. So I got nothing.

When Big Bill was in office he worked to help the middle class worker. He got NAFTA passed. It was he who pushed it thru. That helped the middle class by allowing American companies to move middleclass jobs to Mexico and at the same time, Big Bill allowed as many Mexicans that wanted to to come here illegally to get jobs by lax border enforcement policy. Now in order to be compassionate, he gave their children free education. He gave them social security. He allowed them to get defacto free health care. And all of this paid for by the same middleclass he talked about helping. If you don't believe me, talk to any auto worker in Detroit, any furniture maker in NC, or garment worker in Mississippi.

You post about taking care of Americans first. Spend the money here in America. Then why are Americans, like yourself, so eager to send their money overseas? You posted about debating buying a Honda or Toyota. The profits from them gets sent to Japan. You ride a Japanese motorcycle, profits sent to Japan. You probably have a house full of Chinese made goods, profits sent to China. Back when gas was $1.00 a gallon, you had no problem paying for the Arab oil and sending the profits back to them. You knock Bush and Exxon, but only because prices are high.

Think about what would happen if Exxon really did use it's profits to lower prices........ Say they got gas back to $1.00 a gallon. That would take all the incentives away from making ethonal. Solar and wind projects would be consider too expensive to be viable. Small cars would suddenly be out of style. Hybrids would quickly be museum pieces. Democrats would be screaming that pollution and global warming are growing and that the government should put a $5.00 a gallon tax on gas.

If you listen closely, the Democrats that are running for President are playing on the fears of the average American. That fear most people have is real. And by playing on those fears, it makes them look good.

And to address your concerns about your health care premiums going up, keep in mind that there are 48 million illegals in this country right now a good part of that number came during your great Bill Clintons time in office. They for the most part have no health insurance. Guess who is paying for their care when they go into the emergency room. YOU ARE BLOOMZ. And do you really think that all of that will change when Hillary-Care comes about. She plans on adding more services available to them. This will only drive up the costs further. I have lived long enough to know that there is no free ride. But Hillary and the rest of the Democrats play on the fear most Americans have because it is they who are feeling the pinch right now. The speeches are aimed at them right now, but the results will not solve their plight.

Bloomz you love your Democrats. Why don't you follow their lead in your flower shop. Do you charge higher prices to your wealthier customers and give breaks to the poorer customers? Do you give free flowers to those that have fared less in life? Do you have a sign in your store giving free flowers to drug users, homeless and others? People are real compassionate when its done using other peoples money. But when it come to their own, there is always a different story.

PS, I really loved your picture posted on the other thread. You really are a poster child for Hillary. Keep up the Democrat cause....take from the working, give to the non-working and along the way keeping some themselves.

 

[sfox]

Where Did All The Liberals Go?

Just as soon as you posts facts, the liberals run for cover.

bloomz, are you too busy working on Hillary's campaign? What's she going to promise the middle class next week?

 

[bloomz]

JON, because you believe so much in the Democrats you are blind to Bloomz you love your Democrats. PS, I really loved your picture posted on the other thread. You really are a poster child for Hillary. Keep up the Democrat cause....take from the working, give to the non-working and along the way keeping some themselves.

Not running for cover - running a flower shop.

Sometimes I just can't answer cuz your statements are too wrong to even address, Fox.

I'll say it again tho just to patronize you.

I'm not a Democrat.

Happy now?

opinions vary

blessings

 

[lori042499]

I would love to understand why men who have differing opinions on anything politics have to sound like children fignting over who's turn it is on a video game.....

I know nothing about politics, care to know nothing about politics and will never understand politics.

No matter who you choose it is a losing game it's like picking out which Og you like the best...they all suck its a prerequisite of the job.....

 

[bloomz]

No matter who you choose it is a losing game it's like picking out which Og you like the best...they all suck its a prerequisite of the job.....

Geez I would hope you would pick me Lori.....:handball:

Fox is fun sometimes - he gives me insight into closed mindedness - a trait I am sorely lacking in.

 

[lori042499]

Geez I would hope you would pick me Lori.....:handball:

Fox is fun sometimes - he gives me insight into closed mindedness - a trait I am sorely lacking in.

I would pick you, Bloomz...Only because you make me laugh....

That is how easy it is and probably why I don't like politics, there is no humor in politics only deceit and sadness...

 

[sfox]

I agree

Geez I would hope you would pick me Lori.....:handball:

Fox is fun sometimes - he gives me insight into closed mindedness - a trait I am sorely lacking in.

bloomz, I am going to agree with you. You are a most open minded person. It really is a shame to waste all that space between you ears. :headbang: