Wire service sales trends

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Joe Mioux

Joe Mioux

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Dec 15, 2004
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I just posted on another thread and I started thinking about how much less WS business I have been doing this year.

Here are my statistics

For the year as of yesterday 20-Aug-07.

Incominng down 42 pct v 2006. My five year moving avg shows a 26 pct decline in incoming.

Outgoing shows my business down 11 pct v 2006. My five yerar moving average shows outgoing off 13 pct.

It is however, interesting to note that my outgoings gross sales dollars are higher than my incoming. Traditionally up until this time of year my incomings have outpaced my outgoings. The ratio of in v outs generally change once the holiday season is here and I start sending more out.

How does this relate to your business?

What do you think accounts for this phenomenon? I know we are off on funeral bus, but it is still pretty significantwhen you look at the raw numbers.

Is drop shipping causing this or is it internet orders or is it ppl looking up phone numbers in ONline white pages and calling directly?

Joe
 
I've seen about the same stuff Joe - and my opinion is - it's drop shipping as relates to the incoming, and for the outgoing it's because we now have FOUR 1600 pound gorillas taking all the sending.

I'd love to believe more people are calling direct but my figures just don't bear that out. 5 years ago we had only FTD and 800 competing with us on that level - now that has doubled since TF and Pro got into he game. They're the serious contenders.

More people do call direct, but nowhere near enough more to explain this huge drop in outgoing I think pretty much everyone has experienced. I read this stuff about consumers are wising up and I just wonder why it is that 800PROTFTD keep showing increases then. (No I don't)
 
We were down about $10,000 for EACH WS in 2006 from 2005. The figures for the months in 2007 before I sold it in July showed Tel steady from the previous year, but FTD an even more significant decrease.
 
I find this to be the best news going right about now.

The WS orders have been CARRYING the less than serious flower shops of this country for a long time. Although we know incoming is a very slow death, it has decreased the orders that a local florist would have had at 100%. With less incoming orders to the less than business minded florists, this should put the added pressure to s*** or get off the pot.

The last numbers I believe that were being said was, 1 florist for 15000 pop.
I believe it's more like 20000+.

It's all good.
 
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As I really cannot give hard number because of the limited time I have had my own business, I can make a judgement on my observations over the past ten years...I would say there is many reasons for these numbers, this is a multi-faceted conversation..

I would say that the Internet is the number one reason all numbers have had a drastic change..the internet has changed the way people conduct business on all levels..it has allowed home based business to flourish, it has allowed businesses to compete on a national level instead of a local, it has made it convenient to shop 24hrs on anyone's schedual, between anonimity and convenience it can't be beat.

That being said, the internet allowed businesses that were computer savvy to really get ahead and become cutting edge while some lagged behind and got lost in the shuffle...the majority of m&p B&M shops fall into this catagory. 800-flowers saw this weakness and ran with it as did FTD and TF, then used those same shops to gain a kind of floral immortality. I believe that 800-flowers has got to be getting the vast majority of the floral orders being sent. Proflowers have got to be taking a good portion. Then TF and finally FTD. The numbers people will probably let me know if I am wrong here, as I said I do not know the numbers, this is just an observational veiw.

Some of these orders are same day florist delivered items, but a very large amount of them are drop shipped items and leave our world entirely...There has been a big shift in who has the orders to send over the years...FTD may have been the WS years ago, but now it is 800-flowers...Their business model allows for fillers to be big fillers and some shops like that.

As for out going, again the internet is where its at. Some people are finding local florists, some people are thinking they are finding local florists, somepeople are drop shipping, some are clicking banner ads...it all stems from the internet, this is why Main St America is changing. To see it you need a 20" flat screen panel any where there is and internet connection..pretty soon Main St America will have nothing but restaurants, hairdressers and coffee shops, oh wait a minute, it already does....
 
Lori, right on the money.

My observation as to why 1800 is get more then the share is the lower price point that Americans are looking for.
 
Jerry said:
Lori, right on the money.

My observation as to why 1800 is get more then the share is the lower price point that Americans are looking for.
Click to expand...


That would speak volumes as to why Joe's outgoing is higher total amount while being lower in numbers...Florists generally sell for a higher price than online businesses...like 800- ftd and tf..

I know my average is much higher than the ones I fill all because I was trained to upsell...especially on a wire-out..
 
Jerry said:
The WS orders have been CARRYING the less than serious flower shops of this country for a long time. Although we know incoming is a very slow death, it has decreased the orders that a local florist would have had at 100%. With less incoming orders to the less than business minded florists, this should put the added pressure to s*** or get off the pot.

The last numbers I believe that were being said was, 1 florist for 15000 pop.
I believe it's more like 20000+.

It's all good.
Click to expand...

Care to elaborate?

I'm not following.
 
Jerry said:
I find this to be the best news going right about now.

The WS orders have been CARRYING the less than serious flower shops of this country for a long time. Although we know incoming is a very slow death, it has decreased the orders that a local florist would have had at 100%. With less incoming orders to the less than business minded florists, this should put the added pressure to s*** or get off the pot.

The last numbers I believe that were being said was, 1 florist for 15000 pop.
I believe it's more like 20000+.

It's all good.
Click to expand...

Not too sure I understand this post either???
 
There are 3 florists in my general area that I know personally that do not own their local area. They do some local, but most of their business is discounted orders. 1800, tel, ftd, fsn, what ever the case may be. With less discounted orders to these florists they will not be able to turn flowers fast enough to buy any kind of volume. They probably wont realize it for a while, so the help they have now they will want to keep on, for that next rush of discounted orders. That are drying up. Double whammy.

The less smoke and mirror money to play with, the less they will want to stay around to play.

PS. My post in no way was directed at you Joe. I'm glad you brought this thread up, it just confirms my thinking on what I'm seeing in my area.
 
Jerry said:
There are 3 florists in my general area that I know personally that do not own their local area. They do some local, but most of their business is discounted orders. 1800, tel, ftd, fsn, what ever the case may be. With less discounted orders to these florists they will not be able to turn flowers fast enough to buy any kind of volume. They probably wont realize it for a while, so the help they have now they will want to keep on, for that next rush of discounted orders. That are drying up. Double whammy.

The less smoke and mirror money to play with, the less they will want to stay around to play.

PS. My post in no way was directed at you Joe. I'm glad you brought this thread up, it just confirms my thinking on what I'm seeing in my area.
Click to expand...

Thanks Jerry.

Let me do some thinkin about your posts.

What I am trying to figure out is where are those orders going. If I am down 40 some pct on incoming, did those order cease to exist, did they go to my competitor, did they go to floral direct ship or did they go to some other type of giftware direct ship.

I am trying to forecast trends for the next couple years and how to position my business.

Joe
 
Joe Mioux said:
did those order cease to exist, did they go to my competitor, did they go to floral direct ship or did they go to some other type of giftware direct ship.
Click to expand...

I know Bloomz mentioned customers calling direct but did you include OOA customers that call direct into your incoming percentage?

I would venture to say that some of your lost percentage could be found in direct calls from OOA customers. But, I've been wrong before ;)
 
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