Would You Hire An SEO Firm?

[theRKF]

Based on some recent queries from florists we're looking at putting together a new SEO service plan for florists. I'm trying to find the sweet spot for price vs service, so I'd appreciate some real, honest feedback in this poll.

I'm going to list a few price points, and ask that you check which option(s) you might be inclined (hypothetically) to sign up for. If there is more than one price point that is realistic for you, please choose both.

This poll is private, so your answers won't be displayed. Further, this is by no means a commitment to buy anything - and we won't spam you later

 

[Knife's Wife]

Question....I have wondered for a long time. Is there any way to know how much work one is doing? Not what they tell you they are doing but can you truly measure and know when it comes to SEO?

 

[Simon Says]

Am being told I cannot vote on the poll - upper right-hand corner of the polling space. Is this because I am a "free" member or is their a gremlin in the system?

 

[theRKF]

Am being told I cannot vote on the poll - upper right-hand corner of the polling space. Is this because I am a "free" member or is their a gremlin in the system?

Ok, try again now

 

[theRKF]

Question....I have wondered for a long time. Is there any way to know how much work one is doing? Not what they tell you they are doing but can you truly measure and know when it comes to SEO?

There are lots of things that we track in an SEO campaign, much of which is tailored o the client's goals.

Here's a sample report I just ran on your site. Some of the parameters we would track for a florist include:

• Monthly unique visitors
• Bounce rate per targeted entry page
• % of traffic from search
• Revenue per keyword and traffic source
• Rankings for targeted keywords

The report attached shows the value of the organic traffic you're receiving, and the value of changes month to month, along with potential high value targets for future efforts.

 

[lori042499]

My goal in the next year now that I don't pay tf is to set up some realistic marketing plans and work heavily on my website..I can well take care of my flowershop myself but need help in these two areas...What does SEO entail on a website? Would the price include explaining to me what all the numbers mean on the google analytics? Would that include suggestions on better marketing or solutions to how mite site would perform better?

I am not really sure who does what on websites...in terms of making them work to their greatest capacity...I am obviously not very intune to what my customers want or whay all of a sudden they won't buy from my new site but they bought from my TF site..so I am thinking I need help with all of that in the very near future..

 

[theRKF]

What does SEO entail on a website? Would the price include explaining to me what all the numbers mean on the google analytics? Would that include suggestions on better marketing or solutions to how mite site would perform better?

Bruce Clay, who first coined the phrase "Search Engine Optimization" likes to describe SEO as a 3-legged stool:
1) On-page (or On-Site) factors
2) Off-Site factors
3) Technical factors

With an F20 site like yours we've taken care of #3 - fast server, canonical URL tags, good base site architecture (which you can further adapt), etc.

#1 is about your content, page structure and internal linking. This can also include conversion optimization (making it more likely that visitors become customers)

#2 is about linking, social media, any factors that affect your site but are not directly on your site.

Interesting note: It's a commonly held truth that your final SEO score is based 30% on your site (#1 & #3) and 70% on #2. Further, there is a finite "score" you can get for that 30% - there is a cap on perfection for on-page elements. However, there is no possible cap on your off-site score, since you can always get more links, more Likes, more Tweets, more +1s, etc. Also, the value of those items can increase as well!

Needless to say, we devote a lot of our efforts to the off-site factors, but not to the exclusion of important on-site items like title tags, URLs and microformatted local business info.

The level of communication and explanation is heavily impacted by the budget. Out of necessity, all of our time on a project - strategy, implementation, reporting and communication - is billable hours. There are a lot of companies offering cheap, ineffective SEO options for $150 / month, but you'll never speak to anyone who knows anything.

On the other hand, spend $10k+ / month and you'll have a dedicated account rep.

I find there are strong correlations between SEO campaigns and wedding work in a flower shop. You have clients with different budgets and different levels of neediness. Sometimes the stars align and you get a bride with a big budget who is also level-headed and low maintenance. Other times you'll get a $200 wedding booked 6 months out and spend 2 hours a week for 6 months dealing with emails, phone calls, questions and revisions. Thankfully, most will fall somewhere in the middle.

 

[Eric S]

I would if I did not have the time or the know how’s. Also I'm kind of addicted to this whole website and search engine stuff.

 

[duanermb]

I would if I did not have the time or the know how’s. Also I'm kind of addicted to this whole website and search engine stuff.

Me too!

I recently performed an link analysis on some florist websites. The site on the left has been up and online for over 3 years and is provided by one of the major site providers (OG).



Sadly, you can imaging how much traffic this website gets. If you have a site, you either have to take an active role in it's online development or work with someone like Ryan to develop it to a point where it will show up in the search engines.

Here's how it ranks for some of the specific keywords.



Of course, SEO is only a part of what you need to do. Blogging, social media like facebook etc are also required to do well!

 

[sandytf]

I hope I don't sound like too much of an idiot with this question, but I've always wondered how important SEO is when located in a very small town with little competition? I know a number of order gatherers come up when you search any location, but I've always wondered.....

 

[anytimeflowers]

Sure wish I understood what you just posted, Duane.

I recently had my site graded and it came in with a "C".

My Mozrank Trust Metrics is 3. I used "Flowers" as the keyword for my report card. It appears to me that one of the biggest factors is links, but I really have no clue what I'm doing on those. I have links from 17 unique domains, and 629 links from other sites. Nice to know if I understood how I got them and how to get more! I understand the score could be a whole lot worse, but it could be a whole lot better too.

After all this time, I'm STILL not listed on Yahoo! directory, I just don't know how to get them to list me.

So yes, I imagine some help would be a worthwhile expense.

 

[duanermb]

I hope I don't sound like too much of an idiot with this question, but I've always wondered how important SEO is when located in a very small town with little competition? I know a number of order gatherers come up when you search any location, but I've always wondered.....

Basically the larger the population you are trying to reach, the harder it is, because of greater competition. Some small town florists have large delivery areas that are difficult to rank for outside of their own town because the search engines are so locally oriented.

Geography also plays a role. My city is inside a ring road with farmland for 100 miles around it until the next city. All 70 or so florists ALL DELIVER TO THE ENTIRE CITY! So they all try to rank for the top keywords. <--- Tough to do well, especially against the established florists who have had websites since the late 90s.

 

[duanermb]

Sure wish I understood what you just posted, Duane.

I recently had my site graded and it came in with a "C".

My Mozrank Trust Metrics is 3. I used "Flowers" as the keyword for my report card. It appears to me that one of the biggest factors is links, but I really have no clue what I'm doing on those. I have links from 17 unique domains, and 629 links from other sites. Nice to know if I understood how I got them and how to get more! I understand the score could be a whole lot worse, but it could be a whole lot better too.

After all this time, I'm STILL not listed on Yahoo! directory, I just don't know how to get them to list me.

So yes, I imagine some help would be a worthwhile expense.

Quantity of linking domains and who those domains (websites) are plays an important role. Most florists could outrank their competitors with 5-10 great links even though their competitors may have hundreds of poor links.

Yahoo directory is $299 a year, that's all it takes!

There's a great deal of things going on with SEO that are hard to explain, which is why experts are experts. It's a very small niche. There are a lot of florists who don't believe in SEO that have great sites and great rankings. Their secrets are:

1. Good website provider
2. Claimed listings in the directories
3. Continual addition of new products (changing and updating content)
4. Social media
5. Blogging

If you don't have a guru, do this stuff, it's probably 49% of what works.

 

[theRKF]

There are a lot of florists who don't believe in SEO that have great sites and great rankings. Their secrets are:

1. Good website provider
2. Claimed listings in the directories
3. Continual addition of new products (changing and updating content)
4. Social media
5. Blogging

I think these florists with their SEO are like people who have natural design skill and no training. They do what comes naturally, and it works. Often, those people don't "get" why AIFD matters, or why design classes are required for the rest of us.

There used to be a very loud voice on this forum who said SEO was all "snake oil" and scam artists ... "You don't need to do SEO," he said, "just have unique title tags, post lots of content and get links from all over." He didn't get that his advice IS SEO

 

[theRKF]

I hope I don't sound like too much of an idiot with this question, but I've always wondered how important SEO is when located in a very small town with little competition? I know a number of order gatherers come up when you search any location, but I've always wondered.....

It comes down to a question of whether the investment in SEO is likely to bring a sufficient return. We'd look at search volume data where possible and current web site traffic to try and estimate potential gains. It helps to consider LCV (lifetime customer value) because you're securing customers - not orders - with SEO on your own site. One of the metrics to track would be # of new customers brought in by search traffic.

 

[Mikey the Flower Guy]

I think these florists with their SEO are like people who have natural design skill and no training. They do what comes naturally, and it works. Often, those people don't "get" why AIFD matters, or why design classes are required for the rest of us.

There used to be a very loud voice on this forum who said SEO was all "snake oil" and scam artists ... "You don't need to do SEO," he said, "just have unique title tags, post lots of content and get links from all over." He didn't get that his advice IS SEO

I've got 2x4's and a great sliding compound saw..I'll MAKE an S.E.O. for you!!...

 

[anytimeflowers]

Next questions.

Do I NEED Yahoo!? I should point out that I came in far better than my immediate local competitors but would like to rank in the larger capitol city of St. Paul. Even people who want delivery to W. St. Paul quite often just put St. Paul.

This is another perhaps stupid question. I own "quite a few" domains as pertain to my delivery areas. At the moment, the names are simply forwarded to my main website. Would it be better to launch them each with a page and a link to my main site?

 

[theRKF]

Next questions.

Do I NEED Yahoo!? I should point out that I came in far better than my immediate local competitors but would like to rank in the larger capitol city of St. Paul. Even people who want delivery to W. St. Paul quite often just put St. Paul.

This is another perhaps stupid question. I own "quite a few" domains as pertain to my delivery areas. At the moment, the names are simply forwarded to my main website. Would it be better to launch them each with a page and a link to my main site?

Yahoo! search is actually powered by Bing, so they combine to be a decent chunk of traffic - though nothing close to Google. However, Bing customers tend to be better consumers and higher spenders.

Using micro sites on different domains is only really useful if you plan to really invest time and content in each site.

 

[anytimeflowers]

Using micro sites on different domains is only really useful if you plan to really invest time and content in each site.

Thanks Ryan. So.......is that something that would be considered part of a package? I realize each of them would then have to be hosted but if the time were invested would you speculate that it would or would not be worth the extra dollars invested? Just a speculation, I'm not looking for guarantees here.

 

[theRKF]

Thanks Ryan. So.......is that something that would be considered part of a package? I realize each of them would then have to be hosted but if the time were invested would you speculate that it would or would not be worth the extra dollars invested? Just a speculation, I'm not looking for guarantees here.

For a local shop, probably not worth the effort. You'd want to have unique phone numbers - and possibly even business addresses - for each site. Then you have to consider the pros & cons of multiple Places listings, unique content, managing multiple catalogues to manage, etc.