Florist Files RICO Class Action Over Teleflora's Flower Sales

[CHR]

From Courthouse News

INDIANAPOLIS (CN) - In a RICO class action, a member of the Teleflora network claims that the largest mail-order flower service in the country hijacked its web link to snatch customers. Perfect Flowers says it refused Teleflora's offer to create a website for it, since it already had a website up and running. And it claims Teleflora played the same trick on "other retail florists [who] did not authorize Teleflora to direct Internet users away from their websites to unauthorized websites."

Perfect Flowers claims that it ran its own website, "Flowers By Valerie," and when it signed a contract to receive referrals from Teleflora, it did not authorize the giant chain to operate a website on its behalf.

"Perfect Flowers receives 100 percent of all retail sales obtained through this [its own] website," the complaint states. Its own website "did not require the use of the Teleflora national network."

Teleflora owns and operates the directory website Findaflorist.com, with links to member florists.

But Perfect Flowers says "the operation of and inclusion of Perfect Flowers and Flowers by Valerie is not included in the contract between Teleflora and Perfect Flowers."

Under the contract, "Perfect Flowers agreed to become a member florist and Teleflora agreed to refer to Perfect Flowers orders by other member florists for delivery at 73 percent of the order or sale price," according to the complaint.

Perfect Flowers claims that Teleflora "owned and operated a website which purported to be a website for Flowers By Valerie and could be accessed independently or by a hypertext link from Findaflorist.com."

But Perfect Flowers claims that it never authorized Teleflora to direct Internet browsers "to an unauthorized website for Flowers By Valerie."

Perfect Flowers adds that it "did not authorize Teleflora to collect and keep any of the funds from orders and sales obtained from the unauthorized website for Perfect Flowers and Flowers By Valerie."

In some cases, it says, "Teleflora did not inform Perfect Flowers when someone ordered from the unauthorized website for Flowers By Valerie owned and operated by Teleflora. Hence Perfect Flowers would not receive any customer information for future advertising or other business purposes."

Perfect Flowers says Teleflora refused its request for an accounting of the money Teleflora made from the unauthorized website.

It seeks an accounting, compensation and class damages. Perfect Flowers filed the class action in Marion County Court, then removed it to Federal Court.

Perfect Flowers is represented by Steven Poore.

Remember all those 'free' 'storefront websites' TF created on Findaflorist.com for shops who didn't host with them? Florists had to call and demand they be removed - or pay around $600/year for TF to link to their indy sites.

I noticed the 'storefronts' were gone last week and wondered why. Looks like this is the answer.

Will be an interesting one to watch.

 

[bootcampguy]

I noticed the 'storefronts' were gone last week and wondered why. Looks like this is the answer.
Will be an interesting one to watch.

Thanks, I think you'll se alot more of this. I know of 2 other stores that are seriously thinking of filling against them and others. I personally don't think the RICO statue will apply, there are 3 areas of jurisdiction involved.......so very complicated!!! Deception can only go on for so long...............................

 

[BOSS]

Most definitely an "interesting" one.... have not heard of the RICO laws in years.... seems to me they're most often used for racketeering cases?

I'd say this is a good reason why they went away so fast.... or maybe not

ADDED: Perfect Flowers is represented by Steven Poore. Looking for this lawyer I see he was an Indianapolis atty, as well as a small claims court JUDGE in both Washington and Indiana. He's also on the November ballot in Indiana in the general election....

 

[bootcampguy]

I think they went RICO to have it in federal court because of all the juridictions involved. Back in the 80's when I was a "po po" we used the racketerring statue all the time. Under that statue it allows to be compensated for "long term" damages not seen. Their lawyer has some "big ins"...........I bet there's also a clause in there, "Def. knowing committed deceptive advertising practices" which has not yet defined by the higher courts (that I know of). Some people don't play, they "file".......

 

[lori042499]

Kudos for this shop for standing up for themselves...I would be interested at how much it is costing up front to do this and how much time is involved in this...This is one of those things that most florists wouldn't bother with even if they felt they had a case, simply because of time or money restraints...and TF knows it. Never mind not even knowing what the contract says when we signed the darn things...I hate contracts, they are so hard to read and I am a fairly intelligent person...

 

[BOSS]

One has to "ass-u-me" that the atty's will get a listing of all shops this has happened to via disclosure, then contact those shops perhaps turning this into a small class action.... or not...

 

[bootcampguy]

I had to file a few years ago on one of the stores that I ownerd, filling cost we're about $400 and the attorney was $1200. But by fulling they "have to respond" with in 20 days (in Florida) or automatic "default for Plantiff". So when you file it's like hitting them upside the head with a "Tele directory" and they will make it go away.......90% of the time....next to come is teh "calss action"....he's see a years salary out of this.......I'm happy for them

 

[anytimeflowers]

It seems to me Eric from Everyday Flowers had this happen to him, too.

I believe Teleflora claims that in his case it was some sort of second party deal. (They seem to have a few of those, and they are always the ones that are doing "bad" things".)

I would not be surprised at all to see this become a class action, maybe not with this filing, but future. You really never know what connection this Judge may have, it could be a daughter-in-law who owned a flower shop and got screwed. Obviously, since he changed it to federal, he's doing his research and knows that what he has is the tail of a tiger that could initiate federal law. This would also give him a boost in rankings for his election.

If he can get a federal law against deceptive listings, I'll vote for him.

 

[Rhonda]

if TF took all these doorway pages down then the Search4Florists directory is going to take a hit....they were using findaflorist "web listings" and I brought it to their attention that the one in our town was not a valid florist site, that it was TF's...... hmm, will have to check to see if that one is still up (and a couple others I know of)......

 

[Rhonda]

Here
this is a doorway page still in effect. This shop does NOT have a website.

 

[NicoleAtTF]

Hey, all. So, it's been a few days since the lawsuit was announced, but as you can assume, with any legal action we can't really talk about it until a few things are figured out, first. I can now talk a little bit about what's going on, here.

The first thing is re: Boss's point about this being a RICO lawsuit - our lawyers tell me that this type of suit really doesn't seem to fit the circumstances and we're surprised they chose to go that route. They have more legal type language for that, but really, that's the point on the RICO thing.

As for FindAFlorist, I think I recall having a conversation here on FlowerChat about that in the past. I'll come back and edit this post with a link to that in a few minutes, actually. But here's the lowdown on how this FindAFlorist thing works... We do our best to provide stiff competition to drop-ship floral service by making sure that FindAFlorist is a website that can serve customers in as many areas as possible. All Teleflora members are listed and are told they will be listed when the join Teleflora. For those shops with eFlorist websites, those sites are automatically linked. If shops don't use an eFlorist site, they can pursue having their privately built website linked to FindAFlorist with our customer service team. If no website exists, we still want to help those members have the benefit of potential customer orders from the web and so we build them a holding page.

For any orders that come through a holding page, we do our very best to assure that the customer has their order fulfilled by the florist they selected, but in some cases (if an order is rejected, if their system is turned off for some reason, etc.) that order is instead routed to another local member to do our best to assure that the customer's order is fulfilled in time and by a local shop.

I'm sure I've said it before, but FindAFlorist is really about helping make sure local florists are as easy to find online as drop-ship services are. It's true function is as a referral service to Teleflora's local members. We think that the increase in traffic that it provides is an 'add-on' to the direct web traffic eFlorist or member sites may draw with their own SEO.

I hope that helps to clarify a little? And I will go pull that old thread and come back and link it.

 

[Rhonda]

The point is Nicole that this shop's
"doorway page" only offers 4 options of which they would be able to produce NONE of them. I know that shop doesn't even buy anything other than carnations, mini carnations and daisies. They have no trained designer and most of their designs for a table or vase are a total of maybe 2 - 3" above the container top. The last time they were visited by a rep, it was in July and the display cooler had dead christmas greened arrangements in it. The rep was in horror when she came here and although it was reported, that rep was fired in September and the shop retains their TF status. Then guess who gets the call to fill their "cube container" orders?? TF Headquarters calls me direct.
And I have polled Maine Florists' members and found that most of them did NOT know there was a doorway page on findaflorist for their shop. (those who don't have a TF website). When I was TF, I was not told of the doorway page and when I found it, I demanded it be taken down.
I just spoke with the owner of this shop and she had NO knowledge of "her page" and was even more disgusted to know that the page featured a stem of cymbidiums in a cylinder (at the time I checked it). So what you are being told is not true, as a great many TF members are finding out.....

 

[theRKF]

We do our best to provide stiff competition to drop-ship floral service by making sure that FindAFlorist is a website that can serve customers in as many areas as possible. All Teleflora members are listed and are told they will be listed when the join Teleflora. For those shops with eFlorist websites, those sites are automatically linked. If shops don't use an eFlorist site, they can pursue having their privately built website linked to FindAFlorist with our customer service team. If no website exists, we still want to help those members have the benefit of potential customer orders from the web and so we build them a holding page.

For any orders that come through a holding page, we do our very best to assure that the customer has their order fulfilled by the florist they selected, but in some cases (if an order is rejected, if their system is turned off for some reason, etc.) that order is instead routed to another local member to do our best to assure that the customer's order is fulfilled in time and by a local shop.

I'm sure I've said it before, but FindAFlorist is really about helping make sure local florists are as easy to find online as drop-ship services are. It's true function is as a referral service to Teleflora's local members. We think that the increase in traffic that it provides is an 'add-on' to the direct web traffic eFlorist or member sites may draw with their own SEO.

I hope that helps to clarify a little? And I will go pull that old thread and come back and link it.

Nicole,

For some reason I partially (or mostly?) believe you about the motivations behind the program. Maybe it's too late on a Friday for me to be at my cynical best, who knows. To me it ties in with much of Teleflora's online strategies that seem at times well-intentioned, by poorly executed - sometimes in ways that are harmful to the florist.

In this case, let's break it down a bit: You've said florists know they will be listed in FindAFlorist. Fine.
This is a listing: http://www.findaflorist.com/results.aspx?CityStateZip=04462
This is an unauthorized web page competing against a florist for their own brand name: http://www.telefloraflorist.com/?ID...=FAFCity&dirid=61872&faftype=1&fafvalue=04462
See the difference?

If you sell me a directory listing, I expect a directory listing. The parameters of "directory listing" are pretty well laid out by decades of YP interaction and closer to home WS book listings. We all have a set idea of what a directory listing is.

Spun the other way - how long would it take for me to get a letter from TF's legal team if I put up a web site using their name without their authorization and sent some/most/but not all of the orders to them, all in the name of "helping them" get orders?

We both know they'd sue my behind off

 

[CHR]

The program was an 'opt-out' and listed as 'free' in statements so many, many shops never knew (and still don't know) those orders - transmitted as coming from TF.com - were gathered using their own shop names. They had no imput on product selection, price, nor delivery charge. Customers who went to the site to refresh their memory of their favorite florist's name were now part of Teleflora's marketing database - forever.

IMO it changed findaflorist.com from being a 'directory' to being a large collection of affiliate links. In many major cities, the 'storefront' links far outnumbered the links to actual florist websites.

Many of us have fought very hard to have our business names removed from dOG websites - because they like to use us to add credibility to their sites - and scoop up fees, commissions and rebates in the process.

 

[FANCIES]

I am appalled and disgusted. I never knew all of this. Lies and deception is how I see it. It all makes sense to me now how TF uses findaflorist.com totally to their benefit. I have myself listed in many of the on line florist directories & don't mind paying them at all, but this is ridiculous. How low will TF go in their deception?!!! It's probably anyones guess. I'm getting sicker by the minute!!!

 

[FANCIES]

If no website exists, we still want to help those members have the benefit of potential customer orders from the web and so we build them a holding page.
SOOOOO wrong! I say a listing is ok with the shops name, address, city & state & their phone number, but NOOOOOOOO holding page. That is so deceptive!

 

[BOSS]

The first thing is re: Boss's point about this being a RICO lawsuit - our lawyers tell me that this type of suit really doesn't seem to fit the circumstances and we're surprised they chose to go that route. They have more legal type language for that, but really, that's the point on the RICO thing.

Nicole, thank you... and trust me when I say that myself and most members really do appreciate your candor, and willingness to be a "bridge" between us and the #2 Big Bad Wolf....

As I understand it, the RICO act is a tool to go after racketeering mostly. That said:

I/we/many of us feel that Teleflora's actions involving these doorway pages and other types of actions like this are planned, well thought out methods of operation that remain hidden until someone stumbles onto them. There is NO LEGITIMATE reason for doing business like this. There are many reasons for doing it behind the doors, not the least of which is cash, customer data and potential future sales, where TF keeps up to 35-40% of the CONsumers cash.... You know it, I know it, and everyone here knows it.

There is another potential the RICO Act could make available, and that is looking into the mirror image operational behavior of Teleflora and FTD. The "monkey see/monkey do" type of business practices. You know, where one company has the same clearinghouse percentage, the same value breakdown dollar wise, the same product offerings, the same deceptive methods of operating that mirror the actions of the other. Racketeering at it's fugly best.

There is much more to this than Teleflora trying to run another scam on their current and past members.... I do not think the courts would have a hard time finding florists willing to chat with a judge about their experiences, and I know there are likely hundreds of screen shots and digital files available to muddy the waters a bit....

Opt-OUT is a crooked way of doing business. Simple as that~! It's done on purpose, designed to take advantage of busy people, and usually timed to hit their desks at one of the busiest times of the year when it will likely slide in under unnoticed and they will not know to opt-OUT until after the deadline has passed. Both companies do this, both deserve to be taken to task, and since they do not listen to their members (except the Top 100) perhaps the courts can have some affect.

 

[Eric S]

We do our best to provide stiff competition to drop-ship floral service by making sure that FindAFlorist is a website that can serve customers in as many areas as possible. All Teleflora members are listed and are told they will be listed when the join Teleflora. For those shops with eFlorist websites, those sites are automatically linked. If shops don't use an eFlorist site, they can pursue having their privately built website linked to FindAFlorist with our customer service team.

See thats the problem.

A. When this first came a store front was created for our business because we did not have a TF website anymore..
B. When we called about it we explained we did not need the "free website" and would like the link replaced with a link to our website.
C. At the time this was not allowed.
D. When we asked for the store front to be removed it took a long time. Long enough for me to place an order on the store front "Or The Free Website" only to see my order delivered to my house by another Teleflora Florist.

It really would of been awesome if you guys just added our website link at the time.

 

[anytimeflowers]

It really would of been awesome if you guys just added our website link at the time.

Then they would not have gotten their part of the sale, silly!

 

[NicoleAtTF]

Hey, all. Thanks for all the feedback. I apologize that I don't have great ways of responding to many of the points you've all made here, but in part, that's because I have a very different view of the motivation behind FindAFlorist.

I can't say I'm surprised by the frustration, since it's something that's been brought up before. I think a major part of the reason is the 'opt-out' rather than 'opt-in' status. But I'll come back to something I've said before - the members here are much more engaged in the management of their digital marketing than many of our members. If you ask any of my colleagues who work on FindAFlorist (without first informing them of our conversation here) and I think all would say that they feel their genuinely doing a positive service for those florists who may be a bit less savvy.

The second thing I'd like to point out is that FindAFlorist really isn't intended as a driver of orders to TF.com - it's intended to be a driver of orders to eFlorist sites. Via eFlorist site, and there are many shops who have thrived by increasing their web business on their eFlorist sites. Am I trying to say that we're being self-less with that? Not in the least! We profit when eFlorist sites do well, so we're certainly motivated for business reasons, but I do believe our motivation is beneficial to those who remain listed on FAF.

In my work promoting our company and our members on social sites, I've always done my best to promote FindAFlorist, in fact, because I think it helps customers find an easy gateway to local florists and it helps local florists drive their business via their websites. I think it's a great tool with a lot of value to offer.

I do look forward to keeping a pulse on what you all think as this thing unfolds and will take the chance to take that feedback to management here, as I usually do.

Thanks, all.