How do I get inbound links?

[theRKF]

Thanks Ryan, I had no idea links were important until I started reading the info here, now how to get them is even more confusing.

The one that is missing from my list that I thought would surely be there is Locate-A-Flower-Shop which I just rejoined just for the link. See how little I know about this. thanks for the help and I'm off to read the other 2 links.

Looks like I have a lot of work cut out for me. Could you tell me more how you can help and the cost in a pm please.

I've sent you a proposal by PM. Please let me know what you think

 

[mlou]

Reciprocal links are not dead...There is nothing wrong with reciprocal links.

after testing..
Google's result page:

1. Low authority, non reciprocating site
2. Low authority, non reciprocating site (keyword in link)
3. Low authority, reciprocating site (keyword in link)
4. High authority, reciprocating site (keyword in link)
5. Test page linking to #9 below
6. Test page linking to #2 above
7. Low authority, reciprocating site
8. High authority, reciprocating site
9. High authority, non-reciprocating site (keyword in link)

Yahoo's result page:

1. Low authority, reciprocating site
2. High authority, non-reciprocating site
3. High authority, reciprocating site
4. Test page linking to #8 below
5. Test page linking to #2 above
6. Low authority, reciprocating site (keyword in link)
7. Low authority, non-reciprocating site (keyword in link)
8. High authority, reciprocating site (keyword in link)
9. Link to a blog post that uses keyword as part of the URL

MSN's Result page:

1. High authority, reciprocating site
2. Test page linking to #10 below
3. Test page linking to #1 above
4. Low authority, reciprocating site (keyword in link)
5. Low authority, non reciprocating site (keyword in link)
6. Low authority, non reciprocating site
7. High authority, reciprocating site (keyword in link)
8. High authority, non-reciprocating site
9. High authority, non-reciprocating site
10. Low authority, reciprocating site


I've read Matt Cutt's post about "how excessive reciprocal linking can hurt", Hint: the key word there is "excessive"...

.

 

[mlou]

Here is the Search Engine Watch list of major search engines...You should be listed in all or most of these search engines...they will provide you with a valuable link to your website and increase your ranking.

http://searchenginewatch.com/showPage.html?page=2156221



If you are interested in being listed in these search engines and are not sure "how", please read their "Search Engine Submission Tips"

http://searchenginewatch.com/showPage.html?page=webmasters


Getting listed is fairly simple, just takes some time.

.

 

[RJD]

One of my favorite tools is SEO Quake (http://www.seoquake.com/). It's free, and plugs in to both IE and FF. SEO Quake displays a lot of SEO information besides links.

I personally think the best way to get inbound links to your site is to provide interesting/cool content. People have a heck of a time picking out funeral arrangements--how about providing a guide (with photos) about the funeral traditions in your area, and how to choose the best arrangements? You can get an idea of what we did at http://www.bloomery.com/sympathy_tributes_guide.aspx.

 

[mb0509]

One of my favorite tools is SEO Quake (http://www.seoquake.com/). It's free, and plugs in to both IE and FF. SEO Quake displays a lot of SEO information besides links.

I personally think the best way to get inbound links to your site is to provide interesting/cool content. People have a heck of a time picking out funeral arrangements--how about providing a guide (with photos) about the funeral traditions in your area, and how to choose the best arrangements? You can get an idea of what we did at http://www.bloomery.com/sympathy_tributes_guide.aspx.

Rich, that's a terrific page. You've given me some inspiration, thank you.
Mary

 

[theRKF]

You're bang on, Mlou. Really, there is no way to ban reciprocal links, since that is also what Google uses to understand "communities" of sites related to a given topic. Sites that are seen as a hub in these linking communities are viewed as authority sites.

If Google penalized someone every time two sites linked to each other, the web would be a very disjointed place and the Google index would be much weaker than it is.

The lesson: Don't be dumb about it. Suddenly adding 50 incoming links to your home page with the exact same anchor text over the span of a few days, while adding 50 new outgoing links to those same sites will raise a red flag. As it should.

Ryan

PS - Whenever possible, use editorial links - those placed within content on the site, not sidebars, footers or links pages. Content links are much more valuable, so if you're paying for links be prepared to pay a premium. If you're bartering or trading, these are much harder to get than side or foot links.

 

[kt4ye]

Here's How

I know links are important to get my site well ranked but where do I get them?
Thanks for any help,
Mary

Hello Mary...

Links are important, but NOT as important as optimizing your site for the search terms that are important to you.

Another important aspect is submission to search engines. Unless you do this, you are depending on blind luck tthat they will find you. If you are changing content (as we all do!) then you need to re-submit on a regular basis. I do mine once a month.

Out of curiosity, I used my SEO software to search for "Florist in Weymouth MA" on Google. Your shop did not appear.

Lack of submittals may be one reason, but I scanned your site and came up with a number of areas where your site would benefit from some changes. The complete report -- in WORD -- format is attached. (I think! I've never tried this before on this group!)

I hope this helps!

Bill

 

[coppercountryflowers]

Look at meta tags

My daughter-in-law hooked us up using meta tags, (words that you use on your page that people may put into search engines to find you..). The more that match words they may use, the more times you'll be found.

 

[theRKF]

Bill,

I have to strongly disagree. Firstly, the use of automated "seo" software to analyze sites is rarely advisable. There are too many factors that can't be gauged by software, and too much emphasis is placed on very outdated factors like densities and frequencies. These software packages have been relatively ineffective since about 2003 or so, and are universally panned in the professional SEO community.

One of the biggest flaws, in my personal view, is that they place too much emphasis on one keyphrase and the site homepage. Traffic now comes from hundreds of keyphrases (see Long Tail) and enters your site any just about any page. This is the reality of modern search.

Regarding the value of links - nothing will influence the big 3 search engines more than links and anchor text (see Google Bomb). It's possible to rank highly for terms that aren't even on your page, as long as the links tell the engines that your page is relevant to that term. While Google has claimed they have minimized the effect of Google Bombs, the reality is that link anchor text still rules the day.

Ryan

 

[theRKF]

My daughter-in-law hooked us up using meta tags, (words that you use on your page that people may put into search engines to find you..). The more that match words they may use, the more times you'll be found.

Meta Tags are hidden tags within a web page that describe elements of the document. The Keyword meta tag is routinely ignored by all search engines. The Description tag may be used to build the summary of your page displayed in the search results.

What Bill was alluding to has more weight than meta tags. Using the proper keywords in your text is a vital part of on-page SEO. Just don't be fooled by percentages, density and frequency guidelines. Write for the user, and the search engines will appreciate it.

Ryan

 

[kt4ye]

Bill,

I have to strongly disagree. Firstly, the use of automated "seo" software to analyze sites is rarely advisable. There are too many factors that can't be gauged by software, and too much emphasis is placed on very outdated factors like densities and frequencies. These software packages have been relatively ineffective since about 2003 or so, and are universally panned in the professional SEO community.

One of the biggest flaws, in my personal view, is that they place too much emphasis on one keyphrase and the site homepage. Traffic now comes from hundreds of keyphrases (see Long Tail) and enters your site any just about any page. This is the reality of modern search.

Regarding the value of links - nothing will influence the big 3 search engines more than links and anchor text (see Google Bomb). It's possible to rank highly for terms that aren't even on your page, as long as the links tell the engines that your page is relevant to that term. While Google has claimed they have minimized the effect of Google Bombs, the reality is that link anchor text still rules the day.

Ryan

Hello Ryan...

Well... I'm sure, since you apparently earn your living doing this kind of thing, that you have a greater depth of experience than I.

I suspect that your expert analysis is appropriate for getting a top 10 ranking for a nationwide mass marketer with a keyword of "FLOWERS." In this scenario, you have thousands of sites juggling for page 1 positioning so that they can feast on hundreds of thousand or even millions of seekers. In that environment, every little bit can mean a lot!

But I doubt if that is Mary's marketplace!

The keyword that I selected represented what I thought would be a reasonable keyword for someone that wanted to find a good florist in Mary's town. The search turned up only 8 hits. Mary's site was not among them!

Before Mary can profit from the ideas that you are suggesting, her site MUST meet the minimum criteria for being found! Once these basic issues are dealt with, then issues like links MAY be important. However, for a small community like hers, it may NEVER be a factor.

I say the above from personal experience. A few months ago, MY site was almost as poorly ranked as Mary's. THEN I applied the techniques that I suggested to Mary. Our site -- www.flowerhut.com -- is (for the keywords that I care about, like "Florist in Charlotte NC") page one on all search engines that I care about.

More importantly, my on line sales have quadrupled. In addition, every day I get a call or two from someone that has obviously been on my website and feels more comfortable with our personal touch. Those are ADDITIONAL sales that do not apply directly to my website statistics. I process both my online orders and web-started phone orders with less time invested and with fewer errors or misundersatndings.

And these benefits make my life simpler and more profitable!

Just a small florist's opinion, though.

Bill

 

[mb0509]

Hello Mary...

Links are important, but NOT as important as optimizing your site for the search terms that are important to you.

Another important aspect is submission to search engines. Unless you do this, you are depending on blind luck tthat they will find you. If you are changing content (as we all do!) then you need to re-submit on a regular basis. I do mine once a month.

Out of curiosity, I used my SEO software to search for "Florist in Weymouth MA" on Google. Your shop did not appear.

Lack of submittals may be one reason, but I scanned your site and came up with a number of areas where your site would benefit from some changes. The complete report -- in WORD -- format is attached. (I think! I've never tried this before on this group!)

I hope this helps!

Bill

Thank you Bill, I'm getting to work on the suggestions listed in the report (in between trick or treaters)...there are some really easy to correct items in there that I overlooked and some that I didn't even think about.

I've been submiting my site wherever I can so I am hoping that will help. I will make resubmiting part of my month end proces.

Thank you to everyone for your help, I really appreciate you all taking the time to help me out.

Mary

 

[theRKF]

Actually, Bill, most of my work is with small businesses.

Again, submitting to a bunch of search engines isn't a productive way to go. Most of them are sham sites or crappy directories more likely to hurt than help. Getting a few quality links is the best way to boost a site's visibility.

Please, please don't buy into the resubmitting myth. It didn't work in 1998, and it sure doesn't help in 2007.

SEO is 50% on page, and 50% off page. Yes, you need to have a ready-for-action site, but again I say the biggest single factor in your ranking is links, not some formulaic combination of keywords on your home page.

Ryan

 

[kt4ye]

Actually, Bill, most of my work is with small businesses.
 
Again, submitting to a bunch of search engines isn't a productive way to go. Most of them are sham sites or crappy directories more likely to hurt than help. Getting a few quality links is the best way to boost a site's visibility.
[/quote]
Here, you and I agree. I generally submit to a handful of sites. All but the major search engines are junk!
 
[quote] Please, please don't buy into the resubmitting myth. It didn't work in 1998, and it sure doesn't help in 2007.[/quote]
 
Hmmm... Do I understand you to be saying that if I/we redo our home page and contents for a major holiday, like Christmas, with an entirely new set of keywords -- like "Kinkade Chapel in Charlotte NC" that we should just sit on our hands and HOPE that the search engines will notice the changes? ? ? ?
 
 
[quote]SEO is 50% on page, and 50% off page. Yes, you need to have a ready-for-action site,[/quote]
 
This was the main part of my suggestion. If Mary's site was #11 (page 2) out of several hundred, and her META and Contents and Head and NAME stuff were all optimized, THEN I will buy into the idea that link optimization can help her onto the first page. In Mary's case, my search garnered *8 Hits* [IMG]http://www.flowerchat.com/forums/images/icons/icon4.gif[/IMG] and her shop wasn't one of them.
 
It's kinda like trying to explain to a football team how to get away with a tight end moving pick against a cover 2 defense -- when the team hasn't yet found its way out of the locker room!
 
 
Ryan[/quote]
 
See above ...
 
Bill

 

[RJD]

Links are important, but NOT as important as optimizing your site for the search terms that are important to you.

You need to do both. Optimized pages are how people will find you initially, and these are what people will link to.

But Ryan's very right--don't waste your time submitting. Get links instead. The SEs will find the links and include the site in their index, plus the link adds juice to the ranking. Links are a two-fer for an unknown site.

But, if you still think links aren't that important, take some advice straight from Google:

How can I improve my site's ranking?

Sites' positions in our search results are determined based on a number of factors designed to provide end-users with helpful, accurate search results. These factors are explained in more detail at http://www.google.com/technology/index.html.

In general, webmasters can improve the rank of their sites by increasing the number of high-quality sites that link to their pages. For more information about improving your site's visibility in the Google search results, we recommend reviewing our webmaster guidelines. They outline core concepts for maintaining a Google-friendly website.

Quoted from http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=34432&topic=8524

 

[kt4ye]

You need to do both. Optimized pages are how people will find you initially, and these are what people will link to.

But Ryan's very right--don't waste your time submitting. Get links instead. The SEs will find the links and include the site in their index, plus the link adds juice to the ranking. Links are a two-fer for an unknown site.

But this leaves unanswered the earlier question. Since we florists are CONSTANTLY updating our sites for holidays, how can we be sure that site revisions are found by search engines BEFORE the holiday is over?!

But, if you still think links aren't that important, take some advice straight from Google:



Quoted from http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=34432&topic=8524

<SIGH> Let me try again.

I was responding to the very specific case that Mary raised. I felt I was qualified to do so because her case was so very similar to mine.

Quoting from your Google reference, "Of course, important pages mean nothing to you if they don't match your query. So, Google combines PageRank with sophisticated text-matching techniques to find pages that are both important and relevant to your search."

In other words, the text in Mary's website must match with the query terms. And Mary's site has/had some very specific deficiencies in this regard. The same thing was true with my site until I went to work on it.

A penultimate comment: You quoted Google as saying: For more information about improving (emphasis mine) your site's visibility in the Google search results, we recommend reviewing our webmaster guidelines.

No problem with this. But Mary's website did not need improving. It was invisible. My suggestions should deal with this situation fairly quickly. It did with my site, and I had the same problems that she is currently dealing with.

My experience is that links take a long time to identify and set up. Or do you know some way that large quantities of quality links can be set up by a harrassed and busy small business owner with the same (few) keystrokes that my suggestion entails?

Finally, a question that I am definitely NOT qualified to answer: WHERE in a site should the links appear? Sprinkled throughout the site? On a links page? On the HOME page?

Bill

 

[theRKF]

Hmmm... Do I understand you to be saying that if I/we redo our home page and contents for a major holiday, like Christmas, with an entirely new set of keywords -- like "Kinkade Chapel in Charlotte NC" that we should just sit on our hands and HOPE that the search engines will notice the changes? ? ? ?

That's exactly what I'm saying. Submitting doesn't matter (with the exception of providing Google & Yahoo with the location of your sitemap xml file). The search bots follow links. This is called crawling the web. (See SEO Beginners Guide)

Another quote from the SEOmoz site:

if there are no inbound links to your site, you're not going to get ranked. If you do have inbound links, the SE's will find you organically.

and:

You can submit and if you don't have a decent link pattern it won't do you any good in the long run anyway. If you do have a decent link pattern you will get spidered.

and:

One link to a site will get it indexed in a short period of time, but the more links you add, the quicker and deeper the indexing is.

and:

You don't need to submit to these urls in fact I would recommend against it. It is much better to get picked up from a quality link from a related site.

This was the main part of my suggestion. If Mary's site was #11 (page 2) out of several hundred, and her META and Contents and Head and NAME stuff were all optimized, THEN I will buy into the idea that link optimization can help her onto the first page. In Mary's case, my search garnered *8 Hits*

and her shop wasn't one of them.

Google has 61,300 results for "florists in Weymouth MA" and Mary's site is the last result on the second page. I don't know where you're getting this "8 hits" business.

I'll repeat: Meta Tags don't matter. They are ignored by the search engines for ranking purposes.

 

[theRKF]

But this leaves unanswered the earlier question. Since we florists are CONSTANTLY updating our sites for holidays, how can we be sure that site revisions are found by search engines BEFORE the holiday is over?!

lol ... How often do you think Google crawls site?

Frequently updated sites will get crawled daily. New pages appear in the index within hours. Last time I checked, FlowerChat was getting 6,000 hits per day just from the Googlebot.

For a less trusted site, the crawl rate may be every few days instead of every few hours. Interestingly enough, the best way to increase your crawl rate is to have more inbound links.

But Mary's website did not need improving. It was invisible.

No, it has at least 75 cached pages and Yahoo reports 119 inbound links.

My search for your keyphrase shows her on the second page of the SERPs.

FYI - SEO software is notorious for returning bad results that don't match the actual SERPs

My experience is that links take a long time to identify and set up. Or do you know some way that large quantities of quality links can be set up by a harrassed and busy small business owner with the same (few) keystrokes that my suggestion entails?

Even one good quality link can have a major impact. A "large quantity" of poor quality links will be useless. Focus on quality. Anything that takes a few keystrokes is likely worth about the effort you put int.

Finally, a question that I am definitely NOT qualified to answer: WHERE in a site should the links appear? Sprinkled throughout the site? On a links page? On the HOME page?

All of the above - but they will be regarded differently. Links in the sidebar or footer of a page have less significance than in the main content. Since search engines evaluate not only link anchor text but also surrounding text and placement area, they will place higher value on links deemed to be "editorial" (placed within the actual relevant content on a page, like citing a source).

Ryan

 

[bloomz]

I think it's become more important to run a sitemap program and ping google every time you change your site.

My hosting company just added this function and has made it seamless for me to make a new one any time I make a change.

But WTFDIK - my site recently dropped from a PR 4 to a PR3 - time for some work to figure it out.

I bet it's those stupid link farms that still have me from about 5 or 6 years ago - and I don't know how to get off the stupid things.


side trip - I like FTD's new site design - but the find a florist link seems to be gone gone gone - not that it was worth a shiit anyway. They probably decided against giving away any link juice.

 

[BOSS]

lol ... How often do you think Google crawls site?

Frequently updated sites will get crawled daily. New pages appear in the index within hours.

Ryan

My site's October Bot Stats...::

Shop Wiki Bot 74 per day
GoogleBot 58 per day
MSNBot 48 per day
InktomiBot 33 per day

There are about 40-50 other bots that crawled the site last month...many from over seas... any know what the "Dubai-spider" is ?