Roger & Me II ??
- Thread starter BOSS
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Did you meds kick in Boss! What are you saying?
On another string you stated that the US Auto companies should fold. You were adamant about not bailing them out. Now you're feeling sorry, for as you said, those overpaid union workers. Explain?
On another string you stated that the US Auto companies should fold. You were adamant about not bailing them out. Now you're feeling sorry, for as you said, those overpaid union workers. Explain?
This is the problem I have with the whole thing. American car companys didn't take the time to pull their heads out of their behinds and look at the competition.
According to the news this morning the big fella's were paying 75 bucks an hour with benefits to their employees vs. 42 and hour at honda and toyota. Not to mention their fleet of Lear jets. I have no problem with private companys making money or spending it. But if you are spending it faster than you can make it and expect me to foot the bill????????hmmmmmmmm.
Meanwhile we are handing over billions with what seems like no strings attached, crazy.
This is a no win situation. For the American car company's to fold would be a distaster. But I can't help but be curious to see what would rise from the ashes in the aftermath.
If I were making even half of that 42 bucks an hour the Honda guys are making you would bet I would have a nice little nest egg that would tide me over for some time...even with kids, a mortage and a car payment. Clearly EVERYONE is living beyond their means.
Fox, I understand Boss's frustration here. And I will admit if I had a chance to work somewhere that paid 75 bucks and hour, I wouldn't have to think twice!
Unfortunately, the unions are in the back pocket of our government (look how proudly they stood with President Elect Obama). No vote from these guys is free. You can bet we'll pay it.
I agree with BOSS, I don't think any bail out in the world is going to help this, and it is going to get worse before it gets better.
The older generation survived it on pure grit and determination. Will be interesting to see how this generation survives without their pedicures and SUV's.
According to the news this morning the big fella's were paying 75 bucks an hour with benefits to their employees vs. 42 and hour at honda and toyota. Not to mention their fleet of Lear jets. I have no problem with private companys making money or spending it. But if you are spending it faster than you can make it and expect me to foot the bill????????hmmmmmmmm.
Meanwhile we are handing over billions with what seems like no strings attached, crazy.
This is a no win situation. For the American car company's to fold would be a distaster. But I can't help but be curious to see what would rise from the ashes in the aftermath.
If I were making even half of that 42 bucks an hour the Honda guys are making you would bet I would have a nice little nest egg that would tide me over for some time...even with kids, a mortage and a car payment. Clearly EVERYONE is living beyond their means.
Fox, I understand Boss's frustration here. And I will admit if I had a chance to work somewhere that paid 75 bucks and hour, I wouldn't have to think twice!
Unfortunately, the unions are in the back pocket of our government (look how proudly they stood with President Elect Obama). No vote from these guys is free. You can bet we'll pay it.
I agree with BOSS, I don't think any bail out in the world is going to help this, and it is going to get worse before it gets better.
The older generation survived it on pure grit and determination. Will be interesting to see how this generation survives without their pedicures and SUV's.
In the interest of clarification - the workers don't get $75 or $42 an hour. That's the total estimated cost of labor including benefits, taxes, HR costs, etc.
Yes, that is what I meant with benefits (think I said that up there) but still..... quite a bit of moola
No meds here these days...maybe thats my problem...
I never stated that they should get bailed out...in fact after watching the heads of the Big3 and the UAW testifying on Capital Hill today I think they should be terminated...irresponsible comes to mind...like we can run this into the ground then ask the US Taxpayers (thats you and me sfox) to bail us out.
I posted the Roger and Me thing just to highlight how bad things really are, not to change my position on the bailout.
Even the bailout is being mismanaged. Hell, a group of plumbers in Texas filed for bailout funds to repair defunct houses...and the guy in charge of dolling out the funds can do anything he wants with them, there are no controls... stupid government!
Agree very strongly Boss. Nobody gives away money without conditions. Unreal.
Can we come up with some cockamamie idea to get some quick cash? Let's apply!
Can we come up with some cockamamie idea to get some quick cash? Let's apply!
Probably...the application is only 2 one sided pages...
I like Item #6) You may file jointly with your company only if the company can prove that after it receives funds, they will buy out another smaller company with cheaper employees and fire a minimum of 1,000 of their own current employees.
WTF???????
I was wrong, you need meds. Let one of the 3 car makers go into bankruptcy and the others fall like dominos.
That will freeze spending in this state and even in Midland the economic tidal wave will bury most.
The pain will spread quickly through out the country and into other industries. I think the destruction will move quicker and destroy more that the recent California wild fires.
Welcome to the Great Depression - Part II.
They need the Bail-Out, with strings attached.
What would be funny is to see Rick Wagner, Head of GM, to tell Congress...." Fu_k Off, we'll go into bankruptcy and then tell those who voted for you why the country sank into a depression."
Chezbloom
Well-Known Member
In the beginning, car companys bought out and destroyed fabulous forms of affordable public transportation. They should use any and all bailout money to rebuild great affordable public transportation and fire all the greed pigs who can't even car pool from Detroit to Washington DC and have to each take a separate jet. But wait, that would'nt make them any money.
avenuegardensflorist
Well-Known Member
....yes, I got a sad chuckle out of that one too. The congressperson who brought this up got a gold star in my book.
Like I have said before sfox, I agree with you on "some points' but the thing is...the spending freeze has already happened, and in spite of what you and I think, it's hit Midland too in many ways. We have a 4 year supply of homes for sale, and maybe 5-6 construction companies that have shut down, not to mention the lack of retail sales at independents and a continuing decline in all areas.
This IS the Great Depression Part II... and sure they need the bail out, so what...so do I and I don't even have a private jet...
Wagner's a crook and I doubt he could tell me anything I don't already know about the economy.
Look, I've said before that a Big# failure would be catastrofic for the country, but I have to ask...where does it all stop? Allowing a total failure will result in a restructuring of not only the economy and business, but people's priorities too...probably the most important part of the whole mess.
Got a sad chuckle myself when the CEO's got questioned on whether they would work for a $1.00 to get their companies out of this mess. GM CEO said " Yes, I will work for a $1.00) Chrysler guy said " I already took a pay cut...He made like 14 mil a year and is now making 7.5 mil. Mr. Ford.......Whos great grandfather is probably rolling over in his grave said " Im good right where I am, thanks"
Jeese
Jeese
Case in point... THEY do NOT get it! They want a hand out, and want to keep it all too... yea and I want my boat back!
They deserve ZERO!
Could it be the reason you make a comment like this, is that you own a florist shop? You know, a business that you bust your ass in and make peanuts in the end? Is that how you expect every business to be run?
Joe Mioux
Well-Known Member
from what i have been hearing/reading, the Big 3 are asking for loans, not a bailout.
that is a big difference.
Back in '79 Chrysler borrowed money from the fed govt, paid it back - early - and with interest.
Iacoccos first book was a good read. He really stream lined the costs of that company, made cars that were designed around efficient distribution (i.e. the cars were sized to maximize the number of cars placed in rail cars) etc.
The car co's need to get back to that line of thinking and management.
joe
that is a big difference.
Back in '79 Chrysler borrowed money from the fed govt, paid it back - early - and with interest.
Iacoccos first book was a good read. He really stream lined the costs of that company, made cars that were designed around efficient distribution (i.e. the cars were sized to maximize the number of cars placed in rail cars) etc.
The car co's need to get back to that line of thinking and management.
joe
I'd rather my taxes go for a bailout then for the welfare that thousands will be asking for if they can't find jobs. A bailout means progress, somewhere down the road. Welfare means someone will be eating steak while my family eats beans.
My husband works for Tenneco, which is a GM supplier. He's in maintenance with a lot of year's seniority...so he'd be one of the last to go if it got that critical. But we have taken several financial steps to put us at the least amount of risk. Praying that it's enough.
My husband works for Tenneco, which is a GM supplier. He's in maintenance with a lot of year's seniority...so he'd be one of the last to go if it got that critical. But we have taken several financial steps to put us at the least amount of risk. Praying that it's enough.
Is It important that we bail out the auto industry, or is it that we need to put those people to work.
Getting paid
Is It important that we bail out the auto industry, or is it that we need to put those people to work?
One of these jobs could be developing alternative energy sources.
Public transportation maybe even on a grand scale.
Developing a wire service that is user firendly.
Revamping our election system.
And is war about putting people to work?
all those soilders home withno work
P Bird
Is It important that we bail out the auto industry, or is it that we need to put those people to work?
One of these jobs could be developing alternative energy sources.
Public transportation maybe even on a grand scale.
Developing a wire service that is user firendly.
Revamping our election system.
And is war about putting people to work?
all those soilders home withno work
P Bird
No, I expect every business to run within their means. I take a draw from my business to cover my living expenses, it certainly isn't as much as I would like right now, but my business is young. If I am smart, if I pay attention to my market, if I watch my expenses and create products that sell. I will be successful.
If Im a car maker and I see the market (at least for the past 10 years) is going green, energy efficient, I see my competitors succeeding selling more energy efficient cars and doing it by selling a reasonably priced product and I still continue to make gas guzzlers and luxury auto's that won't have mass market appeal. Who's fault is that?
Meanwhile I still spend at a rate that is bleeding my company dry.
If my business falters for whatever reason, the responsibility is mine. That is the way capitalism works. Nobody said life was fair.
If my business fails due to a horrid economy...oh well, that is the risk I was willing to take to begin with because I can't imagine doing anything else.
I am 100% for people making as much money as they possibly can. Go for it. I don't think anybody had the right to get on Bill Gates ass because he came up with an idea that nobody else thought of. Brilliant, he made billions! Good for him.
You can't tell me if the American auto makers failed big time that Honda or Toyota or other foreign car makers wouldn't see this as a landmark opportunity! One mans failure is another mans fortune.
That is Capitalism my friend. From the ashes rise the Phoenix.
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