Teleflora increasing fees
- Thread starter CHERYL BAKIN
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wildflowerschicago
New Member
In another thread, we were discussing how they could possibly afford what they are spending on adwords and the like. Well, I guess we know who is paying for the WS pay per click advertising. They probably justify it by saying it's all internet...what does it matter if the order comes from your site or ours?!?! I can't believe they can justify that much money for every order placed on your site...there is no work involved for anyone at Teleflora, the software does all the work?!?!
Sorry for going off on a tangent!
Did anyone read the paragraph ahead of the fees being increased. It was stating how they are the best wire service with the most shops and most orders. Guess the more you get the more you want. It should be that Teleflora so great that we should be lowering your fees guess it doesn't work that way.
I still prefer to participate in the one of the big 3 wire services that does NOT direct ship and sends the order to FLORISTS. From what the others have posted, it seems the Tel fees are equal to or less than FTD and bloomnet.
Negotiate the fees. You're a smart business owner... you have read the fine print and you have decided you will not accept an increase.
Negotiate the fees. You're a smart business owner... you have read the fine print and you have decided you will not accept an increase.
bigvic
Active Member
Sometimes better to get from Horses mouth
I called teleflora when i read my statement & what is being discussed, it only applies to shop with more than one wire service, that is receiving from teleflora but sending the rest ftd or other service. there will be exceptions and they are pretty simple, if you are not getting orders to send because of your area, you will not be penalized. the rules are set but there are case by case exceptions. they are just trying to prevent shops that are sending orders through other service and receiving only through teleflora.
I called teleflora when i read my statement & what is being discussed, it only applies to shop with more than one wire service, that is receiving from teleflora but sending the rest ftd or other service. there will be exceptions and they are pretty simple, if you are not getting orders to send because of your area, you will not be penalized. the rules are set but there are case by case exceptions. they are just trying to prevent shops that are sending orders through other service and receiving only through teleflora.
I dropped out of FTD over a year ago and never missed them. I am TF free as of the end of February. I send out more wires than I take in at a minimum of 3 to 1 and sometimes 5 to 1. Check out clearroot.com. It is a florist only wire service that has no monthly fees and no special products you have to buy. You keep 20% on wire outs and you recieve 72% on incoming. Clearroot keeps 8% of every transaction and that is it. Order gatherers are not allowed to join. The only drawback is they don't have all cities and states covered yet. If everyone will drop FTD, TF and 1-800 and join Clearroot, we will be back on a level playing field. Just my opinion...
Yes, you can function without TF/FTD et all.
consider using a CC for all outgoing orders.
or
Send your orders thru IFA (Independent Florists Assoc.) Fees are much much lower. One drawback for me, is that they are not compatible with our POS system.
or
consider a FlowerShop Network membership -- at a lower fee.
All depends on how many outgoing you need to get placed during a given month, and how you want to handle it.
There are many threads about becoming Wire Service Fee. Do a search & happy reading!!!!
Cheryl
consider using a CC for all outgoing orders.
or
Send your orders thru IFA (Independent Florists Assoc.) Fees are much much lower. One drawback for me, is that they are not compatible with our POS system.
or
consider a FlowerShop Network membership -- at a lower fee.
All depends on how many outgoing you need to get placed during a given month, and how you want to handle it.
There are many threads about becoming Wire Service Fee. Do a search & happy reading!!!!
Cheryl
BigVic:
I assumed that the TF increase was to "catch" those who are sending FTD & receiving TF. It's all about the rebate game.
However, why I was trying to warn folks here is because these things get slipped by us, at the end of the statement, during a peak holiday time......and then it is too late to act or react!! Just trying to give some people a little fair warning, that's all.
Also, there have always been exceptions to "the rules". We all know that. My guess is that today, there are a lot of "little people" who are filling a lot of TF HQ orders, and not sending too many orders out -- that are going to get dinged in this scheme.....and they will never be the wiser. At least, that's what TF hopes. I like knowing who is in both my right pocket and my left pocket.
Cheryl
I assumed that the TF increase was to "catch" those who are sending FTD & receiving TF. It's all about the rebate game.
However, why I was trying to warn folks here is because these things get slipped by us, at the end of the statement, during a peak holiday time......and then it is too late to act or react!! Just trying to give some people a little fair warning, that's all.
Also, there have always been exceptions to "the rules". We all know that. My guess is that today, there are a lot of "little people" who are filling a lot of TF HQ orders, and not sending too many orders out -- that are going to get dinged in this scheme.....and they will never be the wiser. At least, that's what TF hopes. I like knowing who is in both my right pocket and my left pocket.
Cheryl
Sher
New Member
Or use Localflowershop or Ilocalflorist to find a florist and send to them! Art put up an interesting yoututbe this week...it is a valid observation I think...kinda brings hiome the point of their usefulness.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXxqW_5flFg the ending says a lot.
I think even the bigger shops are sick of the increases in fees..especially since the economy is so bad....it makes you re-evaluate their value.
I used both directories this month to get orders out to areas that no longer participate with any wire service and we used a directory to find them....it was easier for some reason..I could not find a shop serving a zip code on line but it was in the directory...the shop told me he gets a lot of orders off his listing. Oh yeah..he does not have a website either.
Well its just a thought.
Sher
Just to clarify...
The extra 5% (increased from 4%) fee is called "reciprocity fee." Both FTD and Teleflora have this penalty fee.
"Reciprocity fee" kicks in, when your wire-in order amounts exceed wire-out amounts, 5:1 ratio.
For example, let's say
Wire-in: $2,000
Wire-out: $399
you will have to pay 5% of $2,000, i.e., $100 "reciprocity fee" in addition to 7% clearing fee.
In other words, your clearing fee is now 12%, not 7%.
Most filling florists do not recognize this.
Also note that "reciprocity fee" is not the same as "low sending fee." "Low sending fee" concerns the number of wire-out orders, NOT the ratio of in
ut. "Low sending fee" kicks in when the number of wire-out is less than 20 a month.
For many small shops with less than 20 wire-outs and a lot of incoming orders, they will be hit by BOTH "reciprocity fee" AND "low sending fee."
Interestingly, "reciprocity fee" kicks in when the ratio is >5:1 (inut). But it stays effective, until the ratio improves to less than 3:1, not 5:1.
In other words, let's say you got slapped by this fee when:
in = $2,000 and out = $399.
Next month, you had in = $2,000 and out = $500 (4:1 ratio). You'd think you don't get slapped by the fee this time. Wrong.
Once you are in the "reciprocity fee" group, you can't get out of it until you achieve 3:1 ratio.
In effect, once you become a "reciprocity fee" paying shop, you will be forever paying 12% clearing fee.
Sadly, many florists in this group don't even realize this. Otherwise, I would think they must have a riot.
The extra 5% (increased from 4%) fee is called "reciprocity fee." Both FTD and Teleflora have this penalty fee.
"Reciprocity fee" kicks in, when your wire-in order amounts exceed wire-out amounts, 5:1 ratio.
For example, let's say
Wire-in: $2,000
Wire-out: $399
you will have to pay 5% of $2,000, i.e., $100 "reciprocity fee" in addition to 7% clearing fee.
In other words, your clearing fee is now 12%, not 7%.
Most filling florists do not recognize this.
Also note that "reciprocity fee" is not the same as "low sending fee." "Low sending fee" concerns the number of wire-out orders, NOT the ratio of in
ut. "Low sending fee" kicks in when the number of wire-out is less than 20 a month.For many small shops with less than 20 wire-outs and a lot of incoming orders, they will be hit by BOTH "reciprocity fee" AND "low sending fee."
Interestingly, "reciprocity fee" kicks in when the ratio is >5:1 (in
ut). But it stays effective, until the ratio improves to less than 3:1, not 5:1.In other words, let's say you got slapped by this fee when:
in = $2,000 and out = $399.
Next month, you had in = $2,000 and out = $500 (4:1 ratio). You'd think you don't get slapped by the fee this time. Wrong.
Once you are in the "reciprocity fee" group, you can't get out of it until you achieve 3:1 ratio.
In effect, once you become a "reciprocity fee" paying shop, you will be forever paying 12% clearing fee.
Sadly, many florists in this group don't even realize this. Otherwise, I would think they must have a riot.
Thanks godlfish for explaining this better & giving examples.
Maybe now this will hit home to some people.
Cheryl
Maybe now this will hit home to some people.
Cheryl
"Reciprocity fee" is the main reason why heavy filling florists can't make money. This is the fee that finances the rebate programs.
Because of the way this penalty kicks in, there can be an interesting situation at the end of each month.
For example....
On Dec 30th, you found that in the month of December so far,
wire-ins: $3,000
wire-out: $620
At this point, ratio is 4.84:1, close to, but still below the level (5:1) to trigger "reciprocity fee."
On Dec 31st, you received an order totaling $110. Take it?
You shouldn't. Because if you do, it will trigger the reciprocity fee because now in = $3,110 and out = $620, the ratio = 5.02:1.
The penalty is 5% (used to be 4%) of $3,110, so that's $156.
It would be foolish to take a $110 wire-in, and ends up paying $156 penalty.
A reverse situation is also possible. At the end of month, your ratio is slightly over 5:1. In that case, you might want to use your own money to send out a wire-out, to prevent the penalty to kick in. You would be better off that way (I did this once).
Because of the way this penalty kicks in, there can be an interesting situation at the end of each month.
For example....
On Dec 30th, you found that in the month of December so far,
wire-ins: $3,000
wire-out: $620
At this point, ratio is 4.84:1, close to, but still below the level (5:1) to trigger "reciprocity fee."
On Dec 31st, you received an order totaling $110. Take it?
You shouldn't. Because if you do, it will trigger the reciprocity fee because now in = $3,110 and out = $620, the ratio = 5.02:1.
The penalty is 5% (used to be 4%) of $3,110, so that's $156.
It would be foolish to take a $110 wire-in, and ends up paying $156 penalty.
A reverse situation is also possible. At the end of month, your ratio is slightly over 5:1. In that case, you might want to use your own money to send out a wire-out, to prevent the penalty to kick in. You would be better off that way (I did this once).
I've long wondered about the legality of a reciprocity fee.
AFAIK, the fee is not charged to 'purees', meaning shops that exclusively belong that that WS. It is triggered and enforced when a store is a member of more than one WS.
The affect is to encourage the shop to drop the other WSs, send more orders or pay a penalty for keeping multiple memberships. There's a definite anti-competitive bent.
Like I said, if the penalty was not waived for 'purees', I'd say it was 'fair', but not the way it is applied now.
Goldfish, your math is right - but having to track all the data to avoid even greater costs shows what lengths some local stores have to go to avoid penalties that negate most (if not all) profit potential on incomings.
AFAIK, the fee is not charged to 'purees', meaning shops that exclusively belong that that WS. It is triggered and enforced when a store is a member of more than one WS.
The affect is to encourage the shop to drop the other WSs, send more orders or pay a penalty for keeping multiple memberships. There's a definite anti-competitive bent.
Like I said, if the penalty was not waived for 'purees', I'd say it was 'fair', but not the way it is applied now.
Goldfish, your math is right - but having to track all the data to avoid even greater costs shows what lengths some local stores have to go to avoid penalties that negate most (if not all) profit potential on incomings.
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