I'm guessing the number is closer to 95%. There are very few "sending only" people on these trips. That's not to say that there aren't a bunch of people with National Websites and a billion doorway pages, but at least they have a flower shop too.
Teleflora Top 50 Mexico Trip
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I'm guessing the number is closer to 95%. There are very few "sending only" people on these trips. That's not to say that there aren't a bunch of people with National Websites and a billion doorway pages, but at least they have a flower shop too.
BOSS
FlowerChat Administrator
Don't forget Krogers, Winn Dixie, Loblaws and all the other groceries, especially in FTD's case!
12BucksFor2Dozon
New Member
Well one thing I know, if I was a TFTD member, I sure would be glad that all these top members got to have a high-falutin trip to MEH-E-CO by tricking my local customers into ordering from them instead of directly from me at 100% of retail...
Plus, knowing that they were using *my* monthly fees to fund their excursion would probably make me blow a gasket in ecstasy.
But then again, that's just me.
Plus, knowing that they were using *my* monthly fees to fund their excursion would probably make me blow a gasket in ecstasy.
But then again, that's just me.
I'm calling baloney on this thread.
There isn't a person on this board who wouldn't love to go on one of those trips - how could you?
RC said it - they are absolutely excellent trips, first class accomodations, wined and dined and entertained til you puke, with fun activities for every sort of person - sailing, fishing, diving, snorkeling, ocean kayaking, jet skis, jungle trips, spa visits, all you can drink (if you're so inclined) excellent 5 star meals - not to mention the company of the most successful *florists* in the industry.
Naw hell - I'd rather not go because there's a few dOGs on the trip - right? I mean if he's going to be there I'm staying home.
opinions vary?
There isn't a person on this board who wouldn't love to go on one of those trips - how could you?
RC said it - they are absolutely excellent trips, first class accomodations, wined and dined and entertained til you puke, with fun activities for every sort of person - sailing, fishing, diving, snorkeling, ocean kayaking, jet skis, jungle trips, spa visits, all you can drink (if you're so inclined) excellent 5 star meals - not to mention the company of the most successful *florists* in the industry.
Naw hell - I'd rather not go because there's a few dOGs on the trip - right? I mean if he's going to be there I'm staying home.
opinions vary?
BOSS
FlowerChat Administrator
Yep...opinions do vary...and yes if invited these days I myself would NOT go!! No matter the location!
I'll admit that in days gone by I would have at a drop of the hat. In fact, years ago I was one of those in the inner circle with Bad Bobby. Many of us were.
Boy, were MY ETHICS screwed up back then, but thats ok, cuz I am awake now.
BOSS
FlowerChat Administrator
Um... ah... uhhh.... 1973?
Still, beside the point...you are who you associate with, has nothing to do with *florists* it's the guys running the **game**.
Chezbloom
Well-Known Member
In my opinion FC is the place with the best expert florists anywhere.
Sooooo.....anybody been invited? :cat:
Sooooo.....anybody been invited? :cat:
BamaE4U
New Member
But, wouldn't it be fun . . . . .
Might be tempting to go and meet face to face the scu...er I mean. . . competitive business people who are using the system (put in place by those sponsoring the trip) to their very best profitable advantage.
While the real reason is to make their trip uncomfortable, ask the tough questions about faux flower shops, and ethics in group discussions (perhaps after a few drinks).
Of course you might have a tape recorder to provide documentation and amo for the Florist Detective.
Maybe sneak a little of the Mexican water into their glass. . . . . .
Might be tempting to go and meet face to face the scu...er I mean. . . competitive business people who are using the system (put in place by those sponsoring the trip) to their very best profitable advantage.
While the real reason is to make their trip uncomfortable, ask the tough questions about faux flower shops, and ethics in group discussions (perhaps after a few drinks).
Of course you might have a tape recorder to provide documentation and amo for the Florist Detective.
Maybe sneak a little of the Mexican water into their glass. . . . . .
You're absolutely right.
Please see my edit to my post above and reason for it. It has everything to do with who you associate with, and those are the guys running the game - successful florists.
Mikey the Flower Guy
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Top 100 Trips
I have never been in a group where I didn't learn something....sometimes, it is what not to do. But, in defense of people attending Top 100 meetings, the things I learned from being at these meetings with SUCCESSFUL florists are a world apart from what I have learned at local and state florist meetings.
Sure, there may be a few bad eggs, but, the majority are very hard working, knowlegable owners. This thread almost makes me feel bad that we were a successful florist.
I realize that times change, but, please listen to the people who have been there and actually made it. You can still be ethical and be successful. If you choose not to be a part of this....no problem, but, don't put down everyone that has made Top 100. I promise you that many are ethical and I include myself in that scenerio.
Carol Bice
I have never been in a group where I didn't learn something....sometimes, it is what not to do. But, in defense of people attending Top 100 meetings, the things I learned from being at these meetings with SUCCESSFUL florists are a world apart from what I have learned at local and state florist meetings.
Sure, there may be a few bad eggs, but, the majority are very hard working, knowlegable owners. This thread almost makes me feel bad that we were a successful florist.
I realize that times change, but, please listen to the people who have been there and actually made it. You can still be ethical and be successful. If you choose not to be a part of this....no problem, but, don't put down everyone that has made Top 100. I promise you that many are ethical and I include myself in that scenerio.
Carol Bice
BOSS
FlowerChat Administrator
Carol. if my comment made you feel that way I am truly sorry, you know I hold you in the highest regard, just as I do JB...
My disdain is based on the inner workings of *the companies* involved rather than the TRUE FLORISTS involved, as the companies refuse to do the right thing (IMO of course) where the general membership is concerned.
I in no way meant to disparage any Real Florist. There is nothing wrong with being successful!!
Mikey the Flower Guy
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Carol....don't go there. You need to be very proud of your accomplishments, and that peer group has way more positives than can be found elsewhere!!
Carol & JB -
Thanks for bringing some balance to this subject. Every time it comes up, I feel uncomfortable with blanket swipes at anyone attending top sender events. There are some really terrific retailers in both FTD and TF's groups.
I'm most concerned that the 5% OGs (alluded to by Ted with his 95% real florist figure) are probably responsible for around 50% of the volume of the top 100. Add up Just Flowers, Flowers Sent Today and Kay's and my guess is their combined sending is around 1.2 M orders.
There may be more 'real florists' at those meetings, but their dollar volumes don't hold enough sway to get either WS to clean up the shenanigans at any level. I know some of these guys have actively lobbied for clean up and suspensions of the very worst so how do you think they feel sitting next to the dOGs, even while sipping champagne?
The 'lifers' care deeply about the future of the traditional florist industry. Do you think they want to watch the values of their companies drain away. At some point, the rebate checks won't be enough to offset the losses in local volume, even if they've turned to OGing to make up for it.
Thanks for bringing some balance to this subject. Every time it comes up, I feel uncomfortable with blanket swipes at anyone attending top sender events. There are some really terrific retailers in both FTD and TF's groups.
I'm most concerned that the 5% OGs (alluded to by Ted with his 95% real florist figure) are probably responsible for around 50% of the volume of the top 100. Add up Just Flowers, Flowers Sent Today and Kay's and my guess is their combined sending is around 1.2 M orders.
There may be more 'real florists' at those meetings, but their dollar volumes don't hold enough sway to get either WS to clean up the shenanigans at any level. I know some of these guys have actively lobbied for clean up and suspensions of the very worst so how do you think they feel sitting next to the dOGs, even while sipping champagne?
The 'lifers' care deeply about the future of the traditional florist industry. Do you think they want to watch the values of their companies drain away. At some point, the rebate checks won't be enough to offset the losses in local volume, even if they've turned to OGing to make up for it.
Thanks, Carol. We had a great time at top member, and I was glad for the opportunity to attend.
I hung out with RC, JB & Twila, Janet & Jim from Tidy's, Italo from Ital, Ken Bolt, Gary & Karl, Keith from Beaverton, Frank & Dale, and of course Frank & Lisa Stornelli. What a great, fun and interesting bunch of people! No regrets from me! (Except for that drink I got from Sal ... yikes!)
Ryan
I hung out with RC, JB & Twila, Janet & Jim from Tidy's, Italo from Ital, Ken Bolt, Gary & Karl, Keith from Beaverton, Frank & Dale, and of course Frank & Lisa Stornelli. What a great, fun and interesting bunch of people! No regrets from me! (Except for that drink I got from Sal ... yikes!)
Ryan
BOSS
FlowerChat Administrator
Yea... becareful if ever spend a night on the town with Sal in *his city*... it is an experience!
MANORVILLE
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Originally Posted by Carol Bice 
This thread almost makes me feel bad that we were a successful florist.
I promise you that many are ethical and I include myself in that scenerio.
Carol Bice
Excellent post as always Carol !
As a newbie I'm sure that at times some of my questions could be considered " dumb ", and this will certainly be one of them.
How much involvement is there from let's say Top 100 shops in any of the wire services pertaining to educating and helping smaller,
struggling shops ? Or would that be deemed counter productive by some standards ?
My question is sincere and there is no ulterior motive behind the question.
I honestly don't know!
I base much of my opinion/s on the level of commitment to the entire industry as opposed to the shops singular level of accomplishment, which I do respect and admire on a different level.
Just curious !
Thanks,
Kevin
ManorMan
This thread almost makes me feel bad that we were a successful florist.
I promise you that many are ethical and I include myself in that scenerio.
Carol Bice
Excellent post as always Carol !
As a newbie I'm sure that at times some of my questions could be considered " dumb ", and this will certainly be one of them.
How much involvement is there from let's say Top 100 shops in any of the wire services pertaining to educating and helping smaller,
struggling shops ? Or would that be deemed counter productive by some standards ?
My question is sincere and there is no ulterior motive behind the question.
I honestly don't know!
I base much of my opinion/s on the level of commitment to the entire industry as opposed to the shops singular level of accomplishment, which I do respect and admire on a different level.
Just curious !
Thanks,
Kevin
ManorMan
RC in Dayton and Cincinnati
New Member
RC said:
David L said:
David,
Let's do some simple math.
A fictitious example with rounded numbers:
A large OG sends 100,000 wire orders and earns a ten dollar rebate per order, receives $1,000,000 in rebate money.
Their membership dues are probably $0, but let's say $300 a month or $3,600 a year. If their average order is $50, the wire service makes 7% as a clearing fee or $3.50. $3.50 x 100,000 orders is $350,000.
So the wire service makes $353,600 off of this OG and pays $1,000,000 in rebates. This means the wire service lost $646,400 on that OG.
Now you ask why would the wire services be willing to lose money on their top accounts and then send them on expensive trips?
The answer is simple. The wire services want the 100,000 orders because it's volume that keeps the wire services wheels turning. The more orders going through the system, the more shops the wire service can sign up. You see, membership dues and related services are where the real money is made, the more members, the more money. The wire services know they can't keep their members happy without feeding them orders, lots of orders.
Top 100 Trips
Manorville, thanks for the nice post. I think some of the ones who attended this year could probably fill you in on your question more than me. It has been a couple of years since we sold out....so, I am a little out of the loop.
But, from past experience....there was an enormous amount of talk among those florists as to how to get the smaller shops going in the right direction because when they send orders, they want to know they will be well taken care of. There are many educational classes during these trips. I assure you that the "big" floriist do not want the small ones to go under.
At state and regional meetings with other florists, I hear comments all the time about how "us small people should not give the big people" the time of day. They make sure that the "big" florist doesn't get on boards, etc. That is reverse discrimination. If you will engage some of the successful florist at a meeting and ask questions such as the one in your post....you will not believe how much they will be willing to work with you and help you out. They did not get successful by being stupid.
This board has a wealth of knowledge on it. All are very into helping you understand issues. When we started out about 29 yeears ago from scratch,(actually a $5000 investment) we went up to so many successful people and asked so many questions and then tried to see if they really knew what they were talking about. There are several top members on this board. Several of them are mentioned in Ryan's post. Talk to any of them.
Ryan, I sure miss seeing all the friends we traveled with for years. I'm glad you and the others got to enjoy yourselves. I still do enough shows and presentations that I usually run across a lot of them throughout the country. Many of them shop at the Dallas Market where I set up several showrooms in the Design Center.
Manorville, keep asking questions.
Carol Bice
Manorville, thanks for the nice post. I think some of the ones who attended this year could probably fill you in on your question more than me. It has been a couple of years since we sold out....so, I am a little out of the loop.
But, from past experience....there was an enormous amount of talk among those florists as to how to get the smaller shops going in the right direction because when they send orders, they want to know they will be well taken care of. There are many educational classes during these trips. I assure you that the "big" floriist do not want the small ones to go under.
At state and regional meetings with other florists, I hear comments all the time about how "us small people should not give the big people" the time of day. They make sure that the "big" florist doesn't get on boards, etc. That is reverse discrimination. If you will engage some of the successful florist at a meeting and ask questions such as the one in your post....you will not believe how much they will be willing to work with you and help you out. They did not get successful by being stupid.
This board has a wealth of knowledge on it. All are very into helping you understand issues. When we started out about 29 yeears ago from scratch,(actually a $5000 investment) we went up to so many successful people and asked so many questions and then tried to see if they really knew what they were talking about. There are several top members on this board. Several of them are mentioned in Ryan's post. Talk to any of them.
Ryan, I sure miss seeing all the friends we traveled with for years. I'm glad you and the others got to enjoy yourselves. I still do enough shows and presentations that I usually run across a lot of them throughout the country. Many of them shop at the Dallas Market where I set up several showrooms in the Design Center.
Manorville, keep asking questions.
Carol Bice
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