Are experienced designers a dying breed? Cannot find help!

Eric S said:
I personally disagree that the big guys have it any better then a smaller shop.

As far as what I expect a $15 an hour designer can do? Everything. From designing, to great communication skills with customers.

Someone that does such a good job that your customer stops asking for the owner and ask for that designer.
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I just mean that the larger guys are doing a multitude of "wire type" business, not requiring the great designers. We require a designer that can take a funeral order and make it all in the same hour.
 
duanermb said:
I just mean that the larger guys are doing a multitude of "wire type" business, not requiring the great designers. We require a designer that can take a funeral order and make it all in the same hour.
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Is that really that hard to find? Seriously? With all the designers out of work?
A $15+ designer should be able to take 3 funeral arrangement orders and get them all done the same hour, if not 4. If it's sprays, 2 should be able to be taken and done in the same hour. A $15/hr deisgner should be able to do a dozen roses (very well put together dozen in 6 minutes. a casket spray in 45mins or less....

When I began in this business I was taught- POUNDED in my head "Get your speed up, get your speed up" And they wanted things done very quickly and right the first time.
Every month the boss would go over the phone bill. this was before almost every shop had dove and/or mercury. If our wire out calls were over 4 minutes, I'd get yelled at. And I don't mean told gently- flat out yelled at. I was taught to take an order very quickly, without rushing the customer. I was taught time is money and quality is everything, in design and flowers. Ironicly, I wasn't taught too much about customer service. We were all a bunch of divas who thought we could do no wrong. I learned about customer service later, and honestly, the best teacher I had for customer service was my Nat-Nat at April's in Durango. She had been a bartender. She could deal with just about anybody. Her example was infectious. I followed her example, learned from her and then lead by example. I learned not to get defensive, shut the hell up and just listen... Even so every now and then a customer would get the best of me,,,but it was rare.
 
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Clay,

I was thinking along the same lines as Shannon. I average $300-$400 an hour in production during normal times. Holidays when I'm doing production LINE,(I'm the only line but I line 'em up) I can push to $600-$800 an hour if I'm only designing. Dozen roses are done right into my hand as chop and drop in 2 minutes flat and Valentines, that's $2000 an hour.

But I think a minimum of $200 an hour production for ANY designer is a must. At $15/hr, I would expect them to keep up with me! Obviously a designer is not going to spend the entire shift just designing unless it's a really big operation.

jmo
 
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duanermb said:
Yes.

But I am more speaking of the work ethic you describe. You have to be very lucky to find that in anyone.
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Yup it is about 1 in 10.....and that is with 25 years experience working in all kinds of places...and most flower shops are stupidly loose that 1 in 10 employee because they are unwilling to treat them as such a prize or just cannot afford to pay them what they are worth in the first place..so will settle for something less...
 
After a tough summer with some really crap staff letting me down I will be giving my maternity girl who returns in May and my other saturday girl a good pay rise. I have always really appreciated them but seriously without them this summer i would have been up the creek without a proverbial paddle!!

Colleges over here are simply stopping running the courses and i have found over the past year and a half that those that think they would like to work in a florist simply do NOT realise how hard it is, no matter how much you tell them. It is really difficult to get good staff imo and i have three crackers at the moment so i will be paying them to stay - simple as that. Crap staff, crap business.

My staff are my priority at the moment...
 
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Yes Shannon it is that hard... I mean would **you** move to Michigan?

I have found it better and easier to train them myself from the bucket washing up. We all have different ways of doing things, and I find it easier to teach them correctly rather than to try and break old habits.

I was contacted two years ago by the nearby college/extended learning center to teach a design course. Going rate then was $35.00/class... I declined as the expense for my fuel alone was about that then, and the current teacher was not "teaching" but lecturing on the hows... sorry but I have never seen a designer learn without extensive hands on experience.

There are several good schools across the country that teach, but alas one can not afford to send a trainee to be taught the basics. Starting from the ground up, with someone you think has what it takes is a good way to go.
 
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I may move to Michigan for $30/hr. Feel free to burst out laughing.
If me buying this shop doesn't work out- That Alabama job sounds promising. And I do like to move around! Looks like it's a straight shot from ABQ on I-40.

My dream is Southern Cali coast, but I'd have to be paid no less than $20/hr to move there. Ideally $25/hr. Everytime I've looked into moving to Southern Cali Designers start at $9- $11. So I stay here. I just don't think I could ever make less than $15/hr doing this again, and that includes if I own the shop....Actually it's more of how much I need to take home a month. If I end up owning the shop I know I will work more hours and end up making about $7 an hour, but so long as I take home a certain amount per week, it's all good.
 
there are great designers out there however those of us who have been in the business for 20 plus years and can do a great job need to make over 15.00 a hour.
then there are the young kids who waltz in and say the famous line" i think it would be fun to play and make flower arrangements i want to work and you can train me" how many hundreds of times have we all heard that..........
 
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Now, I am just curious...

Those of you with more than a few employees obviously have way more biz than those of us with little of no staff...How much do you pay really good designers that can do everything from soup to nuts? Now how much would they be worth to you if didn't have to worry about money?

I know very few designers here in the heart of Boston who make more than 15.00 an hour at some very high faluten places...and they are really good designers, many former shop owners...I also know many shop owners who don't make 15.00 an hour even though they are very busy..
 
lori042499 said:
Now, I am just curious...

Those of you with more than a few employees obviously have way more biz than those of us with little of no staff...How much do you pay really good designers that can do everything from soup to nuts? Now how much would they be worth to you if didn't have to worry about money?

I know very few designers here in the heart of Boston who make more than 15.00 an hour at some very high faluten places...and they are really good designers, many former shop owners...I also know many shop owners who don't make 15.00 an hour even though they are very busy..
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Well, I don't own- but I am one of "those" employees. I refuse to work for less than $15 in a flower shop ever. I'm totally worth that and more. I haven't made less than that for years and years.
But as a result- few shops can afford me and some shops can't afford not to afford me.

I can work as a checker at a grocery store for $9 or at a bank or at a number of places with a lot less pressure ans stress.

I decided if I do buy the shop- I will be like OB1. Only hire the best and pay them well. If i can't find anybody to fit that bill I'll do it all myself!
 
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shannonlovesflowers said:
Well, I don't own- but I am one of "those" employees. I refuse to work for less than $15 in a flower shop ever. I'm totally worth that and more. I haven't made less than that for years and years.
But as a result- few shops can afford me and some shops can't afford not to afford me.

I can work as a checker at a grocery store for $9 or at a bank or at a number of places with a lot less pressure ans stress.

I decided if I do buy the shop- I will be like OB1. Only hire the best and pay them well. If i can't find anybody to fit that bill I'll do it all myself!
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I agree Shannon, I stopped working for other people for less than 15.00 an hour many moons ago..now I do it for myself with the hopes that someday I will make more than I ever did working for someone, we shall see...If I sold my shop, I certainly wouldn't go and work for someone for less than 15.00, especially with my work ethic...I know exactly how you feel...and I think I would have a hard time finding a job at that also...

I just wonder why so many high volume shops feel 2-8 dollar an hour employees are better than 1-15.00 an hour employee that does everything...We usually sell better and at higher price points, we are usually faster at almost everything and we don't usually need any direction...Where as a 8 dollar an hour clerk/designer is probably still learning all of this and will need more babysitting than most...I just never got this at all...Now myself, if I needed a partimer it would be to do many of the daily chores that I don't prefer to do like bucket scrubbing, cooler cleaning, store spiffing...That I can see paying a8 dollar and hour person to do, train them to wrap some flowers and sell on the phone and they are good to go...
 
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shannonlovesflowers said:
I may move to Michigan for $30/hr. Feel free to burst out laughing.
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No laughing here... I would not work for someone else for less than that myself. I can guarantee, as I'm sure you would, that anyone paying me that would also make money on my labor, I mean a $350.00 casket spray in 30-40 minutes with 30% going to labor is tripling my labor cost...
 
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BOSS said:
No laughing here... I would not work for someone else for less than that myself. I can guarantee, as I'm sure you would, that anyone paying me that would also make money on my labor, I mean a $350.00 casket spray in 30-40 minutes with 30% going to labor is tripling my labor cost...
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Soooo does that mean good? I mean a casket spray in 30-40 minutes at $30/hr?

I'm confused- It happens a lot lately
 
Now if only I could just get enough people in my shop everyday to take in 4800.00 a day I could hire a sales and marketing person and really be golden...How long does it take for a newer shop to be taking in that kind of cash a day???
 
lori042499 said:
Now if only I could just get enough people in my shop everyday to take in 4800.00 a day I could hire a sales and marketing person and really be golden...How long does it take for a newer shop to be taking in that kind of cash a day???
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I've never worked for one. I think The most our average daily was at the most busiest shop I ever worked for was about $2700 and busy days hovered around $4000
 
I have actually worked for 2 high volume shops...not fun...you actually get tired of designing every day all day..my favorite job was a high end boutique shop in an urban setting...I am working on getting my shop to that point, that was where I made my biggest mistake, I bought a shop that didn't fit my niche, i bought one that was affordable to my budget...I would have been better off starting from scratch, although the few good accounts that this place had probably pulled me through to now, so maybe it wasn't really a mistake...
 
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