FTD's look toward the future

[Griff]

Questions are relevent

Mark, I know you think the questions are interesting, but they are really the 4 questions at the heart of the florist industry today. I'll give you another example. Within the last 3 to 4 years there was approximately 28,000 florists in WS membership. Now there is only approximately 20,000+. If this trend continues, and it will, those grand data bases being used by those specialized POS systems will have large coverage gaps. Remember, these POS systems have no value to any other WS than the one you are currently attached to and these machines can not talk to any other "master". When you start getting down 16,000 - 18,000 members, can you imagine what kind of a $40 arrangement your customer will be able to send to Aunt Martha when the closest florist to the receipent is 20 miles away and delivery is $20 and still discounted. If you think that won't happen, you have florists charging $9 and $10 for local zip code delivery now! What's it going to be like in 3 years. You think you have problems with Proflowers and FTD.com sending boxed flower now? Wait and see what you market share is a couple of years from now based on these trends.

So I say again, these questions are very relevent and are at the heart of the issue. And don't discount question #4. Go to any design show or meeting held at your local wholesaler and look closely at the age of the florists who attend. Do they look like the young agressive type of individuals you need to form any national marketing program?

As I see it, most florists are only looking at their business TODAY and not next week or next month. If some florists want to form a close attachment to a "computer box" and feel it is the most important tool they have, then that's OK. But current trends tell you that "computer box" is rapidly losing it's versitility and is it really worth all the attachment you have placed on it? You've had florists tell you that their flower shop isn't making any real money, but their website is generating most of the profit. What happens to the level of profit if the membership continues to drop and automatic sending can't be done anymore. What happens to that person's base business?

 

[RC in Dayton and Cincinnati]

Griff,

I have a question about "Question #2.

Do you seriously think 1-800, FTD.COM and Teleflora.com plan on letting their market shared drop? Those won't be florist to florist orders, but as florist to florist orders drop, wire service to florist orders will increase. Remember the rules have changed. It used to be wire orders were a way for someone to send flowers to far off towns, now they are just as likely used for local to local customers. So as the local florist's customers get lured away by the wire services, they become increasingly more dependent on the wire services for orders.

So do you really believe the consumer will be contacting the florist or 1-800, FTD and TF in five years from now? As of right now, the trend seems to be leaning towards them.

What are your thoughts?


RC

 

[steve]

Truthfully Griff rather one has a point or sale or not has little to do with rather we form a group to leverage our buying and for brand/ marketing purposes.

And what is needed in a small town is not going to be what is needed in a town of 8000 or more. 85 percent of my state is so small there is little need for wire service or brand hell they barely need a telephone. Being part of a buying / marketing co-operative will not be for everybody just like being wire service free is not for everyone right now.

You are right about the age factor not just from who owns the shops but the fact that very few young people are coming into this industry qualified labor is a very big problem right now.

But just like every industry out there the 20/80 theory applies. 20 percent of all the real florist are doing 80 percent of all the real florist business and that group is the group that needs to get organized. They are the group that has the greatest risk right now they have more vans, larger buildings more employees and can not go back in time. Once you cross a certain growth line you have to keep going forward and anything that stays the same will certainly die.

 

[Griff]

Excellent question, Randy.

I think what you are implying is what question #2 is really about. It isn't about 1-800 or FTD.com losing market share, but rather how a florist thinks they are going to receive orders from "out of town" in the future. If you believe that a fair share of your order input will still come from F2F directly or through a WS, then be prepared for the vast majority of those orders to come from 1-800, FTD.com and all OG's out there. Yes, Randy, you are right. These big guys are not going to give up their market share, and in fact, plan on increasing them.

Here's where the scary part comes in. This is just a theory or a possibility, but very conceivable. 1-800 has decided to handle the 50 largest markets through their "fulfillment centers". I don't know if they have them in all 50 areas yet, but the one in Villa Park, Ill currently handles all the area within Chicago and the suburbs as far out as South Elgin which is at least 25-30 of heavy traffic from Villa Park. All of the florists in Chicago that used to be fillers for 1-800 are no longer needed. Now FTD hasn't yet decided which way they want to go, but I'm willing to bet it has been discussed in depth more than once. Let's just say FTD decides to use 2 or 3 of the largest FTD florists in Chicago and approaches them about being their ONLY fillers. All these florists will have the equipment, experience and manpower and are currently part of the city wide delviery pool. They strike a deal on acceptable percentages and all of a sudden, the rest of some 200 (?) FTD members are no longer needed to fill any or all orders. They will still be able to send orders, but they are going to find those numbers less and less and we all know why. Teleflora will then do the same thing. If florists built their business model on incoming or relying on their WS "partner" for support, how long do you think they will survive? Personnally, I think alot of the large florists would welcome this program as it would get rid of alot of smaller shops and local competition almost over night.

And Randy, I honestly hope that the consumer will contact the florists directly, but I know many will always take the big name to handle their business. These 4 questions are all interlinked so that whatever you decide is the answer to 1 or 2, it has a bearing on how you answer 3 and 4. Hopefully a florist will come to a conclusion that is best for them in the long term and not just until the monthly check arrives.

 

[BOSS]

But just like every industry out there the 20/80 theory applies. 20 percent of all the real florist are doing 80 percent of all the real florist business and that group is the group that needs to get organized.

I think the number is more like 10% of the florists are doing 90%, at least where transfered orders are concerned. Locally delivered orders may be closer to 20/80...

Great points by all in this thread!

Based on the comments so far, the only real hope is to form an International Group covering the US and Canada that could eventually create enough noise and build a new model, as we all know we have little hope of changing any of the current large players.

One other thing, and I may be off base here, considering that it is only profitable for the large players to cover the 50 top markets in the LFC model, if the rest of the country was removed from the mix, would they then loose enough volume to curtail their business? I don't know...

 

[Griff]

Steve, just a couple of points.

Truthfully Griff rather one has a point or sale or not has little to do with rather we form a group to leverage our buying and for brand/ marketing purposes.

But just like every industry out there the 20/80 theory applies. 20 percent of all the real florist are doing 80 percent of all the real florist business and that group is the group that needs to get organized.

First, the idea of a POS does have a very important bearing on a florists business today. I want to make it very clear that I'm not against anyone's POS system, but question 1 is important to force any florist to ask themselves why THEY need it. If you have 3 stores like you do, then the answer is easy - yes, it is an important tool. However, many florists have invested in them for various reasons and now find that their feet are nailed to the floor and do not have any mobility to change the direction of their company. If it is not the concern over tech support, it is over a contact or cost to replace or something else. POS's were and are sold to florists to make their life easier and for many that is not the case. When you invest in this type of business tool, it is almost like you actually form a marriage with a life time partner. The problem is that tool may now hinder your mobility to make important decisions for your company. Basically, if you are not sure where the industry and your company is going to be 5 years from now, how do you know you have the right tool to get you there and who did you really crawl in bed with as your partner.

Now Steve, I have no problem with florists forming buying coops or regional advertising plans. If you can find the right people and make it work for you, then more power to you. However, as for the 20/80 comments, I honestly don't know who is worse off. I think that anyone that is located in the 50 major markets is faced with a great deal of risk. I think anyone that has built their business model on short time gains such as OGing is at risk and anyone that has built their business on incoming wired orders is now at great risk. Answering those 4 questions honestly to yourself help you determine just how much of risk you are confronted with.

 

[Griff]

And BOSS, forget...

about international committees or groups of florists. Committees and groups of people didn't help any of us form our business. No group is going to pressure or change the direction of the WS and most likely the direction of most florists. It is going to be up to the individual florists to work through this mess.

BOSS, I'm the last one to ask for all the answers, but yes the largest florists in those 50 markets are the most likely candidates. You want to play an interesting game. Look at any major market <like Detroit> and determine how far out their delivery pool covers. Now determine the approximate percentage of state population within the delivery pool area. These are all high concentration of populations handled by a select few flowers they count on for quality and service. Now, play your cards right, BOSS and you might become the designated gift deliverer for Midland and you can even stock non-floral items for them so that FTD or TF could provide SAME DAY delivery for these items also and you could cover the whole surrounding area. In time, you wouldn't even have to worry about your flower business. They will provide you with all the business you can handle - until they decide differently. Bob Norton wasn't wrong. He just couldn't put all the pieces together. They are very close now!

 

[flowerknife+us]

Griff,

I have a question about "Question #2.

Do you seriously think 1-800, FTD.COM and Teleflora.com plan on letting their market shared drop? Those won't be florist to florist orders, but as florist to florist orders drop, wire service to florist orders will increase. Remember the rules have changed. It used to be wire orders were a way for someone to send flowers to far off towns, now they are just as likely used for local to local customers. So as the local florist's customers get lured away by the wire services, they become increasingly more dependent on the wire services for orders.

So do you really believe the consumer will be contacting the florist or 1-800, FTD and TF in five years from now? As of right now, the trend seems to be leaning towards them.

What are your thoughts?


RC

If Florists stopped filling wire service orders, the consumer in general would have no other real alternitive but to seek the services of someone local.

Florists of all sizes have been feeding their machine for 15 years. The trend has been for the wire services to concentrate the orders to larger and larger operations because in the long run. Those type operations are the only ones able to absorbe the costs and still make a marginal profit.

I don't hazzard to say that 1-800fl is a prime example of the type of loyality one can expect to recieve at some point in the future. In my view, one should consider who should be the one to pull the rug out from under the other first? He(she) who pulls the rug first has the most to gain in the end.

One should not fear the short term blip to marginal profit. When easily controled, well thought out, short term downsizing. has the potential of far greater long term growth. Especially when the growth comes with a 27% or better margin.

The downsizing, in this case, is divesting ones self of those wire service discounted orders.

The way I see it. Any change in the industry is going to have to come from the top membership. Who are either large well run and long standing retailors, or pure order generators. The top pure order generators, by all measure of logic, must be at odds with the traditional retailers for the orders. Not to mention having to be their collective work force.

Just like the general membership. everybody has to compete with the "host" as well.

If, those who ultimately are stuck doing all the real work, went on strike. What real prospect do the others have to survive? and who stands to gain from the others misfortune?

A sail boat can't move without the wind, no more than a car can run without gas, or a plane fly without an engine.

Who's going to pull the rug from under who, first???

Who's going to show the leadership that others can have confidence in to follow?

Where is the Captian when the ship is listing? Or has he already jumped Ship?

 

[BOSS]

No group is going to pressure or change the direction of the WS

I agree...completely...but helping others to eliminate their exposure to the WS's is a good possibility.

BOSS, I'm the last one to ask for all the answers, .....

Now, play your cards right, BOSS and you might become the designated gift deliverer for Midland and you can even stock non-floral items for them so that FTD or TF could provide SAME DAY delivery for these items also and you could cover the whole surrounding area.

Bob Norton wasn't wrong. He just couldn't put all the pieces together. They are very close now!

Ah yes, Sir...but you do have Good Answers!!!

Playing my cards involves distancing myself from "them" not assisting in the demise of the local florist. I know for a fact that on a phone call I could get Da Dot's orders, and with a bit of effort I could get 800F's stuff for 3 cities covering a population area of about 800K...No thanks! Even tho a friends of mine swears by the process...more important to help the other locals see the flowers for the stems, sadly not all will even listen...

And Bad Bobby...yes he did have a workable plan, just not enuf "personality". I think they'll get it going...but as florists drop out of the current loop (if enuf do) then too the big senders will have coverage issues except for in the 50 market areas...

 

[ROBSWF]

My take...........

Griff,

You bring some very valid points to the surface. I would like to chime in on this if I may.

First, we view technology not as a means in which to transfer orders from f2f in the future. We see it purely as a competitive advantage in marketing & customer service as well as an important management tool.

If all of our outgoing orders were to disappear tomorrow, I would see this as GOOD for the customer and recipient, so long as those orders were going directly to the shops that would be delivering them. I am willing to let that business go in that direction. I don’t think for one minute that any order going through any wire service is ultimately good for any party (customer or recipient). The problem is a very difficult one. If we just stopped taking those orders, or advertising for them they would not make their way automatically to the local florist. In fact that is probably the last place the customer would find. They would no doubt end up under the control of one of the Big 3, 1800, FTD, Teleflora or one of the 1,000 order gatherers.

It is up to us how the future will play itself out here. I agree that membership for these big services are continuing on a downward spiral. Some of the shops clinging to these services are very small and quite frankly are terrible flower shops. And so long as it costs so much for these shops to be members, and the costs just keep going up, the bad will be getting worse. The products being delivered are our worst problem. This is causing damage to our industry name far worse then any of us can imagine.

What I think is in the future. Well, the only way for FTD or Teleflora to remain in the game in the future and take on 1800flowers would be to join them in their own game. That is opening up retail stores. Be it franchise or company owned stores. Trust me these stores or at the very least test stores are coming! It’s the best of all worlds for them. Their trucks, signs and people are everywhere and visible. On a large scale.

Neither of the big two has ever come up with an idea on their own. They have always either copied each other or someone else. They missed the web boom; they copied proflowers and now are taking aim at 1800flowers.

We can say what we want about any of them, but at least Jim McCann was a florist. He was a florist that saw an opportunity to EXPLODE. I have first hand knowledge of what the plans for 1800flowers are. They are becoming the McDonalds of flower shops. Soon they will have retail stores in every market. Once this happens, it will always be follow the leader.

The most important thing for a florist to do now is to become the Oberer’s of their own market. This requires aggressive advertising, exclusive product development, Value & Quality products and strong branding. The amount of flower shops will continue to dramatically reduce. The interesting thing is here that demand for the product will not. We are just going to have to learn and pay attention in more detail to what consumers are looking for.

The florist industry has got to be the only industry turning their back on what consumers are looking for. If people in great numbers are looking for price points in the $30.00 to $39.99 mark, we try pushing them to $50.00 & $75.00. In business this is called crazy!! I have never understood why any business would want less units and higher avg sales. Sooner or later it won’t matter how much money the customers are spending. Because when it’s all said and done there won’t be enough units to pay the bills.

Many have got to re-structure themselves and provide the products and price points that people are looking for. Or someone else is going to do it for them! I think, as I have said before many times. The retail florist industry is operating on an artificially inflated pricing structure. This structure is purely there to benefit middle men companies. I’m not saying we have to be in the bottom of the barrel in price. But there is a perceived value in the minds of people sending flowers as a gift. We must focus on not pricing ourselves out of reach. McDonalds, Coke, Pepsi, Burger King, Taco Bell and so on would love to charge more for everything they sell. But if they out price themselves, they put themselves out of the game!!

It’s time to proactively look at what we have been doing wrong. It’s time to make things right and bring the business back to florists. We have been looking to the wrong people giving us advice on pricing. Consumer perception studies have been done for years now. They all show that people believe florists and flowers from florists are too expensive for what they are receiving. Are we willing to do anything about it? Or do we just want to keep on pretending we don’t know what’s wrong?

FTD’s CEO is in this month’s superfloral magazine being quoted as saying basically florists just don’t get it. He says consumers want lower priced products. Yet they push high dollar codified products in the doors of every member florist. Advertising 50 & 60.00 holiday arrangements coming from florists. At the same time directly shipped products are more affordable coming from them. COME ON!!!! The writing is on the wall, they are trying to KILL the industry. Ken Royer used a descriptive term in his book that hits the nail on the head. Category Killer.

Just my view!

 

[TOTO]

Like many others....I'm making changes to eliminate ANY exposure to FTD...

I'm simply amazed that not many others are...

In this case, the Pied Piper is playing to a herd of deaf mice...

BWTFDIK...Word has it that the heads of the BIG2 think me to be a "loose canon" and a man without a clue....

Hey MARK!

I thought that, ONLY TOTO (back in the day) had been deemed a LOOSE CANON!

And, how stupid I must've been, to really believe that, WEE FLORISTS could and should DIVERSIFY into GIFTS, add that to our SAME-DAY-DELIVERY repetoire, and relish in the EXTREME GROWTH and PROFITABILITY (like they did and DOO) of a new expanded market plan which, would make OUR CASH REGISTERS RING.

Well folks, THE GOOD SHIP EF-DT has turned into the TITANIC with captains who think that, their passengers are more than happy to move some deck chairs around while listening to the band play more of their music.

Time to JUMP SHIP, or at least plan to, since their newer better business model monies do not include investing in any more lifeboats for their own passengers and crew.

 

[Griff]

Just one last question on this thread.

Does anyone have any other scenario other than the one I laid out about FTD and TF using larger well established florists in each of the 50 major markets and maybe some other large populated areas to be their EXCLUSIVE filler partners in the future and completely bypassing the rest of their membership? I saw no one disagree, so does RC, Rob, BOSS, TOTO, Cathy, Mark, Ryan, Sunny, Flowerknife and anyone else that entered into this conversation have any other idea where this outcome will be any different?

Or this this going to be a situation like grade school when two captains were choosing up different teams to play baseball and everyone was hoping they weren't going to be the last one chosen or maybe not chosen at all??

 

[RC in Dayton and Cincinnati]

Griff,

I don't see your scenario happening, at least anytime soon.

The wire services most solid revenue stream is from their 20,000 +/- members. 99% of these florists are members because of, one, the incoming wire orders they receive, and two, the check they get at the end of each month from the wire services.

If the wire services don't spread their orders around evenly, florists won't receive enough incoming wire orders, which, in turn, they won't receive a check at the end of the month. Doing this would cause a mass exodus of the wire services by their members.

Why would the wire services want to give up the easy money they get form their 20,000 members? ...to have better control of quality?? That's never been a big concern in theirs in the past.

My scenario is they (the wire services) will continue down the same path but with increasing intensity which will mean it will cost them more and more to steal the local market away. This will bring new and higher fees to their member florists, but the florists will continue to pay. They'll have to because their local customer base will be too far eroded away.

As easy as taking candy from a baby... or is it, as easy as taking money from a florist.

RC

 

[BOSS]

If the wire services don't spread their orders around evenly, florists won't receive enough incoming wire orders,
RC

I see this a partially true...with a twist...

They will continue to spread orders out as they do today, to the shops they do today, with *some* going to new recruits. However, they will also continue to increase the flow of orders to those larger operations that want them. Basing this *guess* on growing gathering volume, they will (sadly) have more orders to distribute, thus being able to both keep the little Indians happy while at the same time sending more to the Cheifs.

800Flowers will be the major player as far as LFC's goes as they already have them in the works, and while some are doing well, most are not, and I **think** their franchise model may be in for a dent or two if folks can;t hold up their end of the paper they signed. Regarding TFTD, they will continue to utalize slave labor, while at the same time moving more into direct ship as much as possible, all the while trying to compete with ProFlowers for the under $30.00 sale.

There will be some florists that will decide they can make a killing on being *the filler* for their market, and in some locations it may work, and in some models it may work. I do not feel it works well for the medium to small shop , because return on labor and money spent is to low, without enough volume to work at higher margins.

I agree with RC, that as the fight for order share intensifies, they will be forced to spend more money to gather more customers, thus increaseing costs to the sheep that blindly fill without realizing that many of those orders come right from their own customer base.

 

[hcflorist]

It’s time to proactively look at what we have been doing wrong. It’s time to make things right and bring the business back to florists. We have been looking to the wrong people giving us advice on pricing. Consumer perception studies have been done for years now. They all show that people believe florists and flowers from florists are too expensive for what they are receiving. Are we willing to do anything about it? Or do we just want to keep on pretending we don’t know what’s wrong?

FTD’s CEO is in this month’s superfloral magazine being quoted as saying basically florists just don’t get it. He says consumers want lower priced products. Yet they push high dollar codified products in the doors of every member florist. Advertising 50 & 60.00 holiday arrangements coming from florists. At the same time directly shipped products are more affordable coming from them. COME ON!!!! The writing is on the wall, they are trying to KILL the industry. Ken Royer used a descriptive term in his book that hits the nail on the head. Category Killer.

Just my view!

And what a view it is ! ! ! I don't think I've EVER seen a post ANYWHERE that I agreed with more.

And you hit the "nail" on the head. It's time for all the "talking" to stop and for the "walking" to start. Florists have GOT to get PROACTIVE and DO IT NOW ! ! ! If they don't, it won't matter. Cause they'll no longer exist.

 

[carol]

Griff,

for price points in the $30.00 to $39.99 mark, we try pushing them to $50.00 & $75.00. In business this is called crazy!! I have never understood why any business would want less units and higher avg sales. Sooner or later it won’t matter how much money the customers are spending. Because when it’s all said and done there won’t be enough units to pay the bills.

Many have got to re-structure themselves and provide the products and price points that people are looking for. Or someone else is going to do it for them! I think, as I have said before many times. The retail florist industry is operating on an artificially inflated pricing structure. This structure is purely there to benefit middle men companies. I’m not saying we have to be in the bottom of the barrel in price. But there is a perceived value in the minds of people sending flowers as a gift. We must focus on not pricing ourselves out of reach. McDonalds, Coke, Pepsi, Burger King, Taco Bell and so on would love to charge more for everything they sell. But if they out price themselves, they put themselves out of the game!!

It’s time to proactively look at what we have been doing wrong. It’s time to make things right and bring the business back to florists. We have been looking to the wrong people giving us advice on pricing. Consumer perception studies have been done for years now. They all show that people believe florists and flowers from florists are too expensive for what they are receiving. Are we willing to do anything about it? Or do we just want to keep on pretending we don’t know what’s wrong?

FTD’s CEO is in this month’s superfloral magazine being quoted as saying basically florists just don’t get it. He says consumers want lower priced products. Yet they push high dollar codified products in the doors of every member florist. Advertising 50 & 60.00 holiday arrangements coming from florists. At the same time directly shipped products are more affordable coming from them. COME ON!!!! The writing is on the wall, they are trying to KILL the industry. Ken Royer used a descriptive term in his book that hits the nail on the head. Category Killer.

Just my view!

I have mentioned many times that florists need to re think their prices.. I can design a small vase at $15.00 and make a decent profit on it and I can deliver it too.. at the regular delivery price..We call them True Simplicity.. RC has a very neat Sampler tha we can do for $25.. I find customers REALLY THINK FLOWERS SHOULD COST ABOUT $35.00. so I provide some choices in that range.. and I provide alot of choices in higher priced ranges..

I agree that we need to get more traffic into our store so we go after it actively.. sales of under $20. cash and carry.. heck even under $10. cash and carry are kind of like a form of advertising.. while they are here they see what else is available..and we try to make sure there is a lot to see that sparks interest for future business.

As to what the OG's are doing.. well I can't stop them, I can refuse to accept their orders if I please but that is about it. I can try to educate my customers..but you know.. when I go shopping for pleasure, new shoes or something I do not want to listen to a salesperson 'try to educate me' so I am very careful about this because I don't want to *iss off my customers after spending so much $$ to get them to come in

The last thing./. we need to make sure we are playing on a level field.. A woman came in and wants the FFFB on FTD.com site.. in a vase.. it is listed as something like $43.99 and if you want a vase $53.99.. of course the fine print says this is shipped in a box and the vase is put in so your recipient can design these flower s in 'her own special way'. well this woman expects this arrang. as pictured in a vase.. so she is looking at a picture that gives the impression that the flowers come in the vase as shown for the $53.99 .. and of course that is not what the fine print says.. in this case it is easy to fill to her expectations since the price is way high for the flowers shown
So we need to be aware of just what these OG's are really offering..then it is much easier to match or compete..make sure your customer is aware too.. level the field.. We have several PC's in the store and can access a web site while the customer is here or on the phone so we can read along with her just what the competition is saying.. and then we can make our offer ... Level the field.
There are many flower shops in my town that do not have a PC w internet access in the store.. they may have one at home but not in the store..How in the world can you compete without knowing what is going on and can see 'real time' what your potential customer is seeing.. so you can sell her what you can do??

 

[TOTO]

Re: Does ANYONE have a PLAN?

Does anyone have any other scenario other than the one I laid out about FTD and TF using larger well established florists in each of the 50 major markets and maybe some other large populated areas to be their EXCLUSIVE filler partners in the future and completely bypassing the rest of their membership? I saw no one disagree, so does RC, Rob, BOSS, TOTO, Cathy, Mark, Ryan, Sunny, Flowerknife and anyone else that entered into this conversation have any other idea where this outcome will be any different?

Or is this going to be a situation like grade school when two captains were choosing up different teams to play baseball and everyone was hoping they weren't going to be the last one chosen or maybe not chosen at all??

Hey Griff!

Since NONE OF THEM HAVE A PLAN, nor A CLUE about REAL FLORISTS and WHAT WEE DOO, they've all decided to try and REINVENT the WHEEL. Always all about THEIR BOTTOM LINES now with an EXCLUSION versus an INCLUSION of WEE FLORISTS into their long term business model.

Any REAL FLORIST with a clue would be HIGHLY INSULTED over the recent remarks coming from EF-DT's CEO.

He suggests that; "basically florists just don't get it. He says consumers want lower priced products."

While those remarks are true, their florists don't GET IT because THEY DON'T GIVE IT! (profits) Since 1997 and when small bob took the helm, their newer better business model EXCLUDED their own FLORISTS from the HIGHLY PROFITABLE (no labor factor) of DROP SHIP GIFTING.

And, the only use they really have for THEIR FLORISTS now is for all of their PASSIVE REVENUE STREAMS and their SAME-DAY-DELIVERY DILEMMA since, FedEX, UPS, the USPS, and DHL will never be able to DOO OUR KIND UV DOO!

Then, he actually expects DA FLORISTS to go along with THEIR ONLY SOLUTION of LOWERING the BAR with CHEAPER PRICE POINTS in favor of MORE UNITS of SALES (quantity) rather than HIGHER NUMBERS in DOLLARS (quality).

And, only because THEY NEED TO COMPETE with all of the other 800-SKIMMERS and FLORAL DOT CONS and FARM DIRECTS who have tried to bring all of us back to the PRICE POINTS of 1985, or over 20 years ago.

Never once has the magic words QUALITY, $ERVICE, and PROFESSIONAL DESIGNMANSHIP been used in their mantras to differentiate WEE FLORISTS from all the rest!

I suspect that, that's because they really don't care about OUR $ERVICE as they too, expect US to GIVE that away along with the 30% DISCOUNT and FREE DELIVERY TOO!

Of course and while all of THEIR MUCK is being SPEWED, they continue to try and push their HIGH PRICED BRANDED CONTAINERS on their florists, knowing full well that, they can never afford the consumer LOWER PRICE POINTS after investing in their HIGH PRICED BRANDED, filling those with FLOWERS and then, PLACING THOSE GIFTS into the warm hands of a HUMAN BEING versus THROWING THEM at a door.

It's amazing, but nothing new when PEOPLE say one thing while blatantly DOO-ing ANOTHER!

Any REAL FLORIST wanting to offer their customers lower price points as well as CASH and CARRY SPECIALS should do so. However, none of you can afford to carry a partner who has an associated COST TO YOU of a 30% DISCOUNT on the surface and up to a CUMULATIVE LOSS of 40% when you've factored in all of their OTHER ANCILLARY CHARGES.

They've long since made their choice of MOVING AWAY FROM YOU with DROP SHIP GIFTS and FARM DIRECT while only NEEDING YOU for YOUR SAME-DAY-DELIVERY MIRACLE.

Only real difference now is that, they want you to DOO YOUR DOO fore THEM and even CHEAPER than before.

As to SENDING MO JUNK ORDERS to FULFILLMENT CENTERS?

Well, GRIFF, from their points of view, THAT TOO is just another SALABLE COMMODITY to increase THEIR BOTTOM LINES. The only choice is in, CHARGING MO FEES or getting those vendors to AGREE TO AN EVEN HIGHER DISCOUNT.

And, I'm back to suggesting that, things have gotten so bad fore them now that, they're into CANNIBALISM and are more than willing to, EAT THEIR OWN YOUNG!

Only question for any real florist now is whether or not, they want to stay in their POT as the water temperature gets higher and before you know it, you've been BOILED ALIVE!

 

[flowerknife+us]

Florists no longer have the margins to work with as they did in the past. So how can they realistically lower prices.

A companys statements are never an accurate reflection of their true intentions. What florists "don't get" is the wire services vunarability. They depend upon not getting it.

Selling lower priced items is just B.S. A Florist Can sell anything the mass markets do if their willing. $ for $ if all $ recieved is of equal value. And by "merrits of the profession" should be able to to make a better presentation of it too.

It is just the florist cannot offer these items when beat all along the line by the honchos

The honchos are already selecting who gets what. They can change their minds when ever they want or need. Why let your self be in the position to let them pull the rug from under you. Like 1-800fl has done.

Why fill for someone who can't do likewise for you?

Teleflora can't fill for me so I don't for them.
the same would hold true for ftd.

The problem really is the perseption.

Some one changed the function and reason for a wire service. The world was asleep when it went from sending to recieving. I don't think it was the members who really asked for the change. And change they got. Loose pennies.

Making the wire services find a new home(if possible) for a couple 100,000 orders(if not more) would make the Holidaz merry indeed.

 

[PhillyPhlorist]

A loong thread, and many good points......
But some really stand out, and should be highlighted.

One in particular is that the w/s perception or DIRECTION has changed...It has gone from Sending to Recieving. SOOO true! So many shops are in the dark... I know a florist, who up until the .COM $8 a town thing, wanted EVERY .com order they could get. They were a big filler. Now, they woke up. They are still filling a lot - because they have to! BUT, they are cutting down. Thier biz was built and relies on the discounted orders...not a great thing, but it is what it is...it will take time to swing things around. They, like two other "big" fillers in the area are starting to re-think the ROLE of the w/s.

WE are now positioning ourselves to be SENDERS...the way the w/s was originally used for. We sent 18 wire orders FTD today alone. A few TEL... Only got a handful in. We are SERVICING the needs of our customers - and USING the w/s for what it was originally intended for - to wire orders cross state lines...all part of offering our customers our service, and just as importantly, selling them the RIGHT product. (how many of you have gotten orders for funeral baskets/containers going to a home as a sypathy gift!!!)

Sadly, OG's have forced a reversal of the original w/s role.

Time for EVERY florist to see this, time to react. I for one with be VERY selective during the holidays with regards to filling orders. Funny, just a year or two ago I would not have thought this! I have seen the light of the REAL use for wire services - have you?

- Herb

 

[Mikey the Flower Guy]

bout time.....

I don't understand why all of these observations come as a "surprise"!!
Just wait, for those of you whom have become 1800 "groupies", when your "profit margins" will be in your "basement", and your business will be on it's arse!!
My head hurts here....gimmicks, inuendo, and prolific realization, that after ALL the heads up, and ALL the time to "change"....
The ducks are out of the henhouse a little late.....
I see many shop failures shortly....little to NO balance from within to keep them standing!!