Interesting...conversation on ProF

[Rhonda]

The reviewer who stated they sent through Proflowers to a funeral service intrigued me. We know that it was not proflowers who did that design the consumer was pleased with. It was done by a Teleflora florist who designed and delivered that arrangement. That is where the misunderstanding lies with consumers who visit Proflowers. Proflowers delivers the cut flowers boxed with cheap vase (or upgraded I believe) but same day delivery? That's where it has to stop. Sorry if this was hashed out before in this thread. We can all assume that the order came to the shop by Dove or by phone by Headquarters, certainly not from Proflowers or the florist who did the work didn't have any idea whom it came from period.

 

[Blue Oyster Cult]

I did this 5 years ago...

I like this answer. However, you'd be helping Proflowers stay in business by patronizing them. Or maybe customers would see the difference and stop buying from them.

We did this idea and I [posted on that floristboard] back then the results of customers coming in to our shop and seeing what the get with a FED EX TRUCK.

No one cared less with our trial marketing idea but We do know that we spruced those BOX SHIPPED TRIAL ADVERTISING ROSES IN STORE later in the day and SOLD THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm starting to take a Digital Camera to the Hospital and Funeral Home Flower Rooms..Just to show folks what a Box of Flowers looks like compaired to a real florist delivery.

Blue, I did the PRO thing for Education and Show and Tell....Good luck Folks.

 

[George Simon]

Can real florists offer 18 roses of the same quality as the Proflower roses for the same price?
If they can, why not offer both and let the consumer choose. That way at least you give the consumer the choice of spending less. The other way is all or nothing at all.
Don't make the consumer choose and maybe lose the to the Proflowers of this world.
If they want to buy inexpesinve roses that don't look as good or last as long as Rio roses, offer it to them. Don't drive them into Proflowers' arms.

 

[prestonway]

The question is George, "why would a florist WANT to offer 18 roses of the same quality as Proflowers for the same price?"

Not all customers are as price sensitive as you are George. Some customers actually want long-stem roses that are artfully arranged and last twice as long...and are willing to pay for it!

The minute that price becomes the only issue, roses become a commodity & only the lowest price wins. Next thing you know, we'll all be walking the boulevards in Miami, selling roses through the car window at "5 roses for 5 dollars"!

"Don't make the consumer choose and maybe lose to the Proflowers of this world?" Why not lose to them? Do we really want the "bottom feeders" as customers? Should we offer 30cm or even 20cm roses, just to under-cut the competition and capture an unprofitable market?

Just like there is low, medium, and high priced floral software...one gets what they pay for. Don't try & be all things to all people...concentrate on your market niche & leave the rest for Proflowers (or MAS or Advantage, in the case of software).

 

[LORRIE]

Prestonway-Sorry to say it's not 5 roses for $5 here close to Miami it's 25 roses for $5! Very , Very tough to compete with that and Publix our local market selling Arranged pieces for $15.00. The regional differences in this industry are MAJOR. They even have Publix set up as a order taker for FTD!
Probably the best thing I offer my customers is SERVICE, A SMILING FACE, and ARTISTRY. I must compete on that level or we are finished. I make it a point to come out of the back room to greet EVERY customer even when my Asst Mgr is here to run the front. Customers like to be treated like they are appreciated. Around here roses are a commodity-but they only get my
here at Flowers For You, Inc!

 

[George Simon]

Not all customers are as price sensitive as you are George. Some customers actually want long-stem roses that are artfully arranged and last twice as long...and are willing to pay for it!

I'm not price sensitive at all. I get my flowers for free.
So you choose not to fight the Proflowers and 800-Flowers and just let them have that market, instead of offering your customers a choice? Mercedes, Jaguar, Lexus, Infinity... they all offer their potential customers a choice of models rather than have them go somewhere else to find something they can afford.
You can buy a Mercedes for about $35,000 or one for $100,000+. That is a pretty wide range. To me it sounds like you are saying that you only want to offer the $100,000+ model and have your competition have all the customers that cannot afford it.

 

[CHR]

George -

I'm curious about your take on the images used with proflowers.com products. Do you think consumers are likely to think the flowers are delivered 'as pictured'? Do you believe they understand that 'assembly is required'?

I venture to say that most of us receive calls from churches with requests to 'put together some boxed flowers sent for a funeral.' We get this type of call at least a few times a year.

Consumers are presented with images of professionally arranged products. In the food industry, photos of cooked items must be labeled 'serving suggestion' because not all meals turn out like the picture on the box (and I doubt most arrangements turn out even close to those photos.)

Should we be lobbying for a disclaimer that states 'assembly required' on the direct-ship sites?

 

[BOSS]

So you choose not to fight the Proflowers and 800-Flowers

Not me~! I just plan to do it in a different way, and thats thru education of botht e CONsumer and the Real Florists. We will regain that which we have let go, but it will take time...

Knowledge is POWER!

 

[George Simon]

George -

I'm curious about your take on the images used with proflowers.com products. Do you think consumers are likely to think the flowers are delivered 'as pictured'? Do you believe they understand that 'assembly is required'?

I venture to say that most of us receive calls from churches with requests to 'put together some boxed flowers sent for a funeral.' We get this type of call at least a few times a year.

Consumers are presented with images of professionally arranged products. In the food industry, photos of cooked items must be labeled 'serving suggestion' because not all meals turn out like the picture on the box (and I doubt most arrangements turn out even close to those photos.)

Should we be lobbying for a disclaimer that states 'assembly required' on the direct-ship sites?

To be honest with you, I have never visited the Proflowers site. I will do that right now.
OK, I typed www.proflowers.com and was promptly hijacked to the florist.com site.
Anyhow, I got back to the Proflowers site and I see a picture of 18 roses of assorted colors for $29.99. When you click on "Details" you see a larger picture and

Includes eighteen fresh-cut, assorted roses. Flowers are hand-picked and tied, then shipped directly from our fields along with your personal message. Vases are available during check out.

It also states that if you want Saturday delivery, it is an additional $9.99. So far, no deception.

Now I'm at the order screen and see that I can upgrade to 2 dozen for an additional $9.99. An "elegant pink vase" is another $9.99. So now the 18 roses will cost me close to $40. Delivery is another $9.99. So we are up to $50 ($49.96 to be exact). I guess that is it, because they are asking me to confirm my order.
So basically, I can get 18 roses from Proflowers with a vase, delivered the next day for approx. $50. No sales tax. I do have to put the roses in a vase and add water.

Even though I was looking for it, I could find no deception. Every additional charge was clearly stated. The pictures did not show b/b or greens, just the roses.

From a real florist it would cost me $65 for 12 roses (vase and water included, I presume) plus at least $5 for delivery plus $6 +/- sales tax. So we are talking $50 for 18 roses vs $76 (min.) for 12.
Would the roses be nicer? More than likely.
Would they be beautifully arranged with b/b and greens? I'm sure.
But my point is that 75% of the consumers that do this type of comparison would only see $50 for 18 vs $76 for 12.

That is why the Proflowers and 800-Flowers out there get thousands upon thousands of orders each day and even more during holidays. You cannot ignore this consumer base! In my opinion, you should offer them a choice. Let them spend their money with you, not Proflowers or 800-Flowers.

Believe me when I say that I want to see every real florist prosper. I can't sell flowerSoft to Proflowers or 800-Flowers and I'm seeing way too many real florists struggling financially and too many going out of business.

 

[BOSS]

To be honest with you, I have never visited the Proflowers site. I will do that right now.
OK, I typed www.proflowers.com and was promptly hijacked to the florist.com site.

Thats funny... I guess FTD is trying gurilla tactics...

So far, no deception.

Unless you count the RE-direct...

That is why the Proflowers and 800-Flowers out there get thousands upon thousands of orders each day and even more during holidays. You cannot ignore this consumer base! In my opinion, you should offer them a choice. Let them spend their money with you, not Proflowers or 800-Flowers.

I agree, and only by eliminating all the florist wanna-be's from the same day delivery feature we control will we beging to see change...then, once we have a viable florist base to combat these types of businesses with national advertising, then it will be time to go after their customers.

Believe me when I say that I want to see every real florist prosper. I can't sell flowerSoft to Proflowers or 800-Flowers and I'm seeing way too many real florists struggling financially and too many going out of business.

Here again, I agree...too many Real Florists don't even know there is a problem, or if they do, they don;t know what the problem is...

I did notice on the ProF site that their Teleflorist Delivered roses are $49.99 by the dozen....I wonder, do they add delivery to that amount?

 

[sunny]

This crap is how Wal-mart went from a regional chain to the largest retail outfit in the world , by selling a slightly lower quality product for a vastly reduced price. It's bad enough these days that you have to advertize cash & carry specials just to survive , but now we have to go online and compete one on one with the Wal-Mart wannabe's of the internet world. What's the latest figures on the cheap rose deal many dumb florists signed up for with FTD , haven't seen it advertized in a while. If this deep discounted stuff is what you want , by all means go for it, hope your pockets are deep enough.

 

[BOSS]

What's the latest figures on the cheap rose deal many dumb florists signed up for with FTD

Not sure, but I have not seen it advertised either...I do know many that signed up for it originally, but I also know alot that STOPPED doing it!

 

[ROBSWF]

This crap is how Wal-mart went from a regional chain to the largest retail outfit in the world , by selling a slightly lower quality product for a vastly reduced price.

Actually Wal-Mart is responsible for lowering the value of the item in the consumers minds. If consumers are battered with advertising telling them that flowers and roses are cheap, don't you think the same will happen here?

Problem is in most markets all across the US consumers feel that flowers from florists are too expensive. This is partly due to the wire services promoting and advertising products that contained very few flowers, and the cost of the arrangement itself has been increasing through the roof over the last 15 years. This also in part caused by the wire service. Higer sales on units return better results in % to both the sender and the clearinghouse and do very little for the recieving shop. I don't think operations seeing higher sales and less units are doing good for themselves. What about when the units keep falling? And they will. Sooner or later the units will drop off to near nothing and it won't matter how high the indvidual sale was at all.

 

[BOSS]

What about when the units keep falling? And they will. Sooner or later the units will drop off to near nothing and it won't matter how high the indvidual sale was at all.

We are already seeing this..."Branded sales" account for less than 15% of my wire biz...hence I did not order ANY of the offerings for Y2K5...

Teleflora folks have a better chance at selling them, but not the FTD offerings....cheap, OLD Style, with no Pizazz!

 

[CHR]

Thought I'd share this post from Yahoo's Provide Commerce (ProFlowers) message board. http://finance.messages.yahoo.com/b...rd=1607360426&tid=prvd&sid=1607360426&mid=415

Valentine's Day recipients tend to be in the same house, or at least the same town, as the sender. When that's the case, the sender sees the product. Often, that makes them more likely to ask for refunds (margin hit).

Moms are out of town, and--let's face it--far more forgiving than our wives/sweethearts ;-)

Emphasis mine.

Counting on the fact that the sender doesn't see it? That's one heck of a strategy, don't ya' think?

Contrast that with the fact that most real florists especially hope the purchasers do see what we provide.

*shakes head*

 

[CHR]

ProFlowers announces Q3 Earnings

Fiscal Third Quarter Results

Here ara a couple highlights.

The Company reported net sales of $57.2 million for the third quarter of fiscal 2005, up 40% from $40.7 million in the third quarter of fiscal 2004.

"Two primary factors caused our earnings to be slightly lower than our guidance. First, although gross profit percentage improved year over year, it was lower than we anticipated due to increased promotional offers during the quarter. We did this to maintain our position which we believe is the quality and value leader in the online floral category. Second, we spent additional IT dollars on website improvements which will directly affect the customer experience and ease of use which we believe will further enhance customer satisfaction and loyalty."

For the three month period, the Company added approximately 422,000 new customers.

To that end, the Company expects marketing expenditures to fall within the 22 - 23% range of net sales for the year, up from the 21 - 22% of annual net sales as previously anticipated.

Emphasis mine.

The stock closed today at $25.675, down $0.53.

The conference call addressed the competition between the major online flower sellers. Fuel costs and surcharges were an issue since they rely on direct shipping. The CFO was asked if they planned to raise prices to offset these costs. He danced around but basically said no.

Their average order decreased slightly from the same quarter in 2004. Questions were asked about downward pricing pressure from the competition as well as their planned efforts to raise average orders. They continue to believe that low prices are one of their more effective strategies to bring in new customers.

Increased marketing costs - competition from other flower and gift sellers - is costing them $14-16 per new customer. (I believe that's a good bit less than 1800 and FTD.) The CFO called some of the other online marketers' expenditures 'irrational behavior'.

Provide Commerce has been a high growth company. But with today's report, while sales and customer aquisitions increased substantially, profits did not. I expect to see this stock take a hit in the near term.

 

[CHR]

After Hours Trading is Going Nuts!!!

Well the last comment in my previous post was an understatement for the day.

In after hours trading, and following the earnings announcement, the stock has slid $25.67 to $17.95. http://finance.yahoo.com/q/ecn?s=PRVD

Yet another example of why I tell our broker to never put any flower stocks in our portfolio. :tongue

 

[mlou]

FTD is dropping too

Down from $13.95 on Feb 17, 2005

Closed at $10.84
http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=ftd
.

 

[Dazeal]

"Valentine's Day recipients tend to be in the same house, or at least the same town, as the sender. When that's the case, the sender sees the product. Often, that makes them more likely to ask for refunds"

True true. And on the flip side wired out flowers from a florist are close to perfect right? Wonder how many people would be pissed when they saw what the florist wired out for them and what was filled. I hear how mad customers are all the time because of this.. and this is florist to florist... the best we have to offer! This Cathy, as you know, is the main weakness my biz will take full advantage of. Daily, I quiz customers about the new idea, and 100% of them who order online said they'd switch and never look back. It's a no brainer.

On another subject, since I like to hijack these threads, I am a magician, sleight of hand type, not some voodoo crazy type. Been doing it for 15 years now. One of the greatest lessons I have learned is if you allow your audience to think they know the magic trick, they'll quit looking for the real way the trick is done. If a magician doesn't do this, it leaves the audience’s mind to work. For example, if I stick a card in my sleeve, just enough for them to see it, they'll concentrate on that card, and in their mind their defense comes down, because they think they have already solve the trick. Little do the know, the card has noting to do with it, I'll pull a coin out from behind their ear. Out of 1000 card tricks I have ever seen, there is not one that has the card up the sleeve. After doing more research, I found out about 90 years ago magicians made that tale up so that their audience would walk away or assume they knew the trick when in actuality, the magician kept the secret to himself. What does this have to do with Flowers? Nothing, I told you, I have A.D.D. and it is past 2 am.

 

[BOSS]

Wonder how many people would be pissed when they saw what the florist wired out for them and what was filled.

Many are, especially when they are accustomed to getting what they like from their local florist. I know it's the reason I did a full family funeral yesterday that is being transported to KY today...

not some voodoo crazy type, I have A.D.D. and it is past 2 am.

OK, and I have a bridge past 2am? and you're **here** ??? Have a nice day!