Need Help Want To Be Ftd Free!

[BOSS]

The biggest item to keep in mind is leave owing them money. They will try to screw you. Remeber the guy holding the money has the upper hand.

No problem there....

And you may be right about the contract, but they don;t have one I signed, because it does not exist...dad retired a couple years ago...and Grandpa signed the original...this could be fun

 

[Victoria]

The biggest item to keep in mind is leave owing them money. They will try to screw you. Remeber the guy holding the money has the upper hand.

Amen to that... amen to that.

V

 

[Joe Mioux]

Hmm....

You know, when I fired FTD at the main store, I think they still may owe me $600 plus. Back in DEC 05 the last statement had a -$6xx.00 atttached to it.

I hope i get it, but you know what....

I sleep better not fretting over the absorbantant membership fees....

That was one shoe....

Joe

the next shoe is untied.............................

 

[Rosebud06]

How do you guys send flowers to other states if you don't have FTD or Teleflora?

 

[Joe Mioux]

How do you guys send flowers to other states if you don't have FTD or Teleflora?

I have two TF memberships.... I like them... but i am debating on whether I need two numbers


I have a really big problem with florists sending orders to me via non WS and expecting a 20 pct payback...

Their is no reciprocity which is a problem for me.

If you choose to be wire service free, then give the filling florist 100 pct of the order and don't be a a G.D. tight-wad about it.

Florists who are WS-free and send outgoings and expect a 20 pct fee are nothing better than the O.G.s. Those florists just participate on a lot smaller scale.

Many, not all, participate in this practice to serve their customer but do nothing to enhance other flower shop's needs wanting to serve their own respective clients outgoing floral needs.

Joe

 

[Rhonda]

reciprocity is not a concern for small town florists. It is very rare that a shop we send an order to sends one to us. That has always been a very low point of concern to us. I have a lady that sends to her mother every @@@@ holiday (Duluth MN) I have yet to receive an order from there......
Another sent for 30 years to South Gate CA, never received an order in return. Can name a great many, including the greater Boston area and the grand state of FLA (can you say snowbirds???) Reciprocity is a non entity. You want to find a florist, keep your old directories when you "get out".....with the internet if you are savvy enough, you can pick which ones are showing WS images and which are showing their own.........Credit card and it's done. If you don't want to hassle with sales tax and %'s......just charge a service charge to cover your expenses of time and phone calls.
Or if you are of a mind to, ask the customer if they would like to talk to the florist themselves??? And gladly give out 800 #'s or a direct shop number.
Point in fact, for many years we sent to a shop in Brooklyn NY. This year, we didn't for some reason send the orders through for the same customer, BUT in return, the recipient we used to send orders to (through the WS) is calling us direct to place their orders........customer education?? Not sure. But there are other ways to get your orders through without a wire service.

 

[bluebonnet]

I have two TF memberships.... I like them... but i am debating on whether I need two numbers


I have a really big problem with florists sending orders to me via non WS and expecting a 20 pct payback...

Their is no reciprocity which is a problem for me.

If you choose to be wire service free, then give the filling florist 100 pct of the order and don't be a a G.D. tight-wad about it.

Florists who are WS-free and send outgoings and expect a 20 pct fee are nothing better than the O.G.s. Those florists just participate on a lot smaller scale.

Many, not all, participate in this practice to serve their customer but do nothing to enhance other flower shop's needs wanting to serve their own respective clients outgoing floral needs.

Joe

Amen to that!!!

"If you walk like a Duck, act like a Duck!"
You want -20%? , then you need to act & participate in WS's to get that %!

"Money talks and Bullsh@@ walks!"
Money given to me @ 100% my prices, that's talking; your walking if ask or talk your price is lower then mine! (b/c you had no directory to know my pricing/codifications)

Had a shop call me the 20th, said no WS, we used to be but not now, I said go ahead, then asked for a doz price, I said $100 w/ del. She said that's a little pricey don't you think, we only charge $55? Told her no, that's my everyday of the year price, then says she only has $55 for the doz and b/c she is paying direct I should accept the order, I told her no thank you, then she had the nerve to ask if I knew of another florist in the same zip, I told her the other 2, now she wants the phone #'s? I told her politely, I do not know the numbers or have the time to look them up, please look in the phonebook or on the computer where you found mine, have a nice day, good bye and hung the phone up.

Maybe there are several that do not do this as being WS free, but this is what I have experienced with the WS free florists, to me it's no better then the WS OG. DG & whoever else is out there acting up!......
Hopefully in the future I might be able to experience a real WS free florist to see how it is without and what all the whoo la la is all about, but I'm with Joe on most WS free shops are acting more like OG's but at a lower level!

And to think we don't have enough on our plates to worry about being in the WS's now we have to worry about the ones that aren't , plus all the other negative stuff out there too! Lordy, Lord the list just keeps growing.

Cyndi

 

[carol]

reciprocity is not a concern for small town florists. It is very rare that a shop we send an order to sends one to us. .

Rhonda.. I think you have the concept backwards.. the reciprocity idea is (like the original wire service concept) that I allow you the sending florist a 20% commission because when I need a florist in your area you will allow me that same 20% commission. So it isn't about other florists calling orders to me..it is about me being allowed to and knowing who to call my orders to when I need to have an order delivered outside my area.

If a ws free shop calls us there is no incentive or benefit to me to offer that 20% commission to that ws free shop... I am doing that shop the favor to fill their order.. they are not doing me any favor at all and in fact by not being a part of a known group of florists w a directory the chances that I can ever find that shop again to have them fill an order for me are slim to non existant.. so the only one winning on this scenario is that ws free shop that gets this 20% commission.

 

[TOTO]

WOW! That's MERCENARY!

Had a shop call me the 20th, said no WS, we used to be but not now, I said go ahead, then asked for a doz price, I said $100 w/ del. She said that's a little pricey don't you think, we only charge $55? Told her no, that's my everyday of the year price, then says she only has $55 for the doz and b/c she is paying direct I should accept the order, I told her no thank you, then she had the nerve to ask if I knew of another florist in the same zip, I told her the other 2, now she wants the phone #'s? I told her politely, I do not know the numbers or have the time to look them up, please look in the phonebook or on the computer where you found mine, have a nice day, good bye and hung the phone up.

And to think we don't have enough on our plates to worry about being in the WS's now we have to worry about the ones that aren't , plus all the other negative stuff out there too! Lordy, Lord the list just keeps growing.
Cyndi

Back in the OLDEN DAYS, I too was a victim of the WS mentality and viewed a FLORIST DIRECT ORDER as a problem.

My member mind frame then was, if you're not a MEMBER of MY CLUB, you can't get your order through my door.

Things have changed dramatically, especially over the past eleven years, and now I view the WSs as a liability and the REAL FLORIST DIRECT ORDER as an asset.

As a PROFESSIONAL COURTESY, we give that F2F REAL FLORIST their usual 20% commission, especially since, it was their advertising and efforts which created that sale.

Fore MEE, the benefits we gain is the NET payment amount of 80% rather than 71% and our money is in our bank account in 48 hours rather than 30 to 45 days via a WS.

Further, our money (net profits) are not further eroded by the monthly dues and fees of the WS.

This F2F phenonom is rising each and everyday as more and more REAL FLORISTS view the WSs as a LIABILITY on their spreadsheets and dumping them, not to mention the fact that, BOTH WSs ARE IN DIRECT COMPETITION with REAL FLORISTS in the battle for their own customer's 100% floral sales while using their monthly dues and fees money to do it!

Had this florist called us, we would've gladly accepted their order for boxed roses at $55.00 plus our $10.00 $ervice charge for delivery, less their EARNED 20% COMMISSION.

Wholesale Rose prices are back to normal now and so are our consumer prices on our Long Stemmed Freedom Roses.

To ask a fellow florist for $100.00 (Feb 20th) is, in my opinion, price gouging and mercenary, especially since, they are my counterpart, unlike the WSs who seem to take pleasure in the art of CLOAKING their orders on behalf of all DA SKIMMERS and NON LOCAL PHONIES whose CANCER pervades our FLORAL INDUSTRY!

Give me the F2F order anytime and the WS can keep that Pink Bouquet Standing Moss Cross on a 42" Easel with a sash of Pink Spray Roses and Standard Pink Roses for their totally ridiculous SRP of $81.95 (including delivery) which, OH BY THE WAY, must be delivered on SUNDAY before 9:00 AM because that's when the memorial service will be held at that Church. NAW! We always SEND THEIR ORDERS back to their JUNKYARD because that's where their JUNK orders belong.

So let's compare the two: 12 F2F Roses boxed and delivered nets us $52 in our bank in 48 hours. COGS $15 COD $7 = net profit of $22. Cross nets us $57.40 less COD ($7) = $50.40 less COGS & COL = $44 = net profit of $6.40 for which I will wait 30 to 45 days to reconcile.

Of course, we would have no intention of making a SUNDAY TIMED DELIVERY before 9:00 AM without our SUNDAY SPECIAL MESSENGER DELIVERY $ERVICE CHARGE of $30 in REAL MONEY versus WS WAMPUM, and so, that issue is moot.

But, had all things been equal, my choice between these two types of orders is obvious and so, YOU DECIDE?

ENOUGH ON OUR PLATES NOW? NAW! Only thing which counts is HOW MUCH IS IN YOUR TILL when YOUR DOO BEE DONE! And the KIBBLES and BITS and SCRAPS and CRUMBS from the WS table couldn't fill a demitasse saucer let alone a REAL FLORIST'S plate.

 

[MANORVILLE]

Hot topic.

Florist to florist, non WS is a tough call. 100% to the filling shop is nice !
No reciprocity has many faces.

Our shop, though located on one of the highest travelled roadways in Long Island generates very little sending. We fill like crazy, but always feel badly that reciprocation is a problem. ( I'd love to send buckets of orders to the florists that have faithfully supported us and relied on our talents over the years, but as yet haven't mastered the sending, but we are trying. )
Some shops could care less. Take the order and that's it.

We tried the non WS 20% and got beaten down time and time again.
Took the advice of many in the biz for generations and now turn the orders away.

 

[Joe Mioux]

[/B]


As a PROFESSIONAL COURTESY, we give that F2F REAL FLORIST their usual 20% commission, especially since, it was their advertising and efforts which created that sale.

toto:

carol has stated and reinforced my point very well.

If you want to send orders out without the benefit of a WS network, fine, do it.

Charge your customer a fee, which should include your costs of business plus a reasonable profit for your business..


But, for God's sake don't ask some florist that you may not know or ever do business with ever again to give you a discount to enhance your bottom line of Net Profit.


Be upfront with your customer tell them this is what it will cost them to have you transfer their order.

Now, for your comment regarding Bluebonnet's rose prices, she has her overhead and you have yours. I believe in previous posts she commented that her delivery is $15.00 per delivery. That means her roses are $85.00 per dozen. That is her price and if she can get it fine. If her customers want to walk out and find another shop at a lesser price, then they can go and find a better price at one of her competitors.


Sincerely

Joe

 

[Rosebud06]

$15.00 delivery fee....................OK how do you figure out how much to charge for deliver.
I assumed it was one price for in the city and it got higher the further out you went.

 

[Joe Mioux]

$15.00 delivery fee....................OK how do you figure out how much to charge for deliver.
I assumed it was one price for in the city and it got higher the further out you went.

You need to add up all your costs of owning and operating a delivery vehicle, plus the cost of labor.

divide that amount by your yearly estimated deliveries and use that as you cost + profit for each delivery

joe

 

[MANORVILLE]

But, for God's sake don't ask some florist that you may not know or ever do business with ever again to give you a discount to enhance your bottom line of Net Profit.


Joe[/quote]


That settles that issue !
Well said Joe

 

[hcflorist]

toto:


But, for God's sake don't ask some florist that you may not know or ever do business with ever again to give you a discount to enhance your bottom line of Net Profit.

Hmmmm . . . Not that I disagree with that part of your thesis . . . but isn't that EXACTLY WHAT YOU"RE DOING MOST OF THE TIME WHEN YOU SEND AN ORDER THROUGH A WIRE SERVICE ? ? ?

I fail to see why expecting a discount should be any more acceptable on a wire order than on a direct order. Your reasoning would probably apply to the majority of wire orders sent by most florists, too.

 

[Rhonda]

Rosebud, if you email me your address, I'll send you a copy of our newsletter that states it out plain and simple on how to figure what your delivery charges should be. [email protected]
Rhonda

 

[Joe Mioux]

Hmmmm . . . Not that I disagree with that part of your thesis . . . but isn't that EXACTLY WHAT YOU"RE DOING MOST OF THE TIME WHEN YOU SEND AN ORDER THROUGH A WIRE SERVICE ? ? ?

I fail to see why expecting a discount should be any more acceptable on a wire order than on a direct order. Your reasoning would probably apply to the majority of wire orders sent by most florists, too.

No,

With the WS, its a balancing act between outgoing and incoming.

With WS-free florists, they send with little expectation of receiving.

Some ppl here on FC have even commented, that they kept their old Wire Service directories and use that as the reference to call out their outgoing orders.

Now, for these WS-free florists they have an easy and convenient directory at their disposal.

My question to you is, since they are no longer listed in WS directories, how do I find them as easy and conveniently as they found me?

Joe

 

[MANORVILLE]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosebud06
$15.00 delivery fee....................OK how do you figure out how much to charge for deliver.
I assumed it was one price for in the city and it got higher the further out you went.

Our delivery fees are based on our large delivery area. Locals are now a straight 8.00 and it increases to 15.00 for our most distant areas.
Vehicle, vehicle costs, labor and gasoline/diesel are all considered.

Joe

As far as the how to find non WS florists I'd guess that the only way would be a search on the internet, and they'd be found somewhere behind the WS and OG's.


As for geographical pricing, I can see $100 per dozen on the roses less delivery at times and dependant on the rose quality.
Everyday roses, no way ! Long stem premiums with exceptional longevity like what I buy, go for 75.00 to 125.00 every day without complaint.
Maybe a grunt or two but after the recipient receives our product they tend to become frequent orderers and referrers.
Quality costs as we all know.

 

[hcflorist]

With the WS, its a balancing act between outgoing and incoming.

With WS-free florists, they send with little expectation of receiving.

That's the theory. And that's the way it was supposed to work. And for many, it did. But that was in the days before the order gatherers started competing against real florists for all of those outgoing orders. Now, for the majority of florists, the "balancing act" is nothing more than a cruel myth. It's such a well documented and well known myth that hardly anyone other than those with big sending operations who are depending on the wire service model for their very existence have the nerve to try to fool real florists with that malarky any more.

Some ppl here on FC have even commented, that they kept their old Wire Service directories and use that as the reference to call out their outgoing orders.

Now, for these WS-free florists they have an easy and convenient directory at their disposal.

My question to you is, since they are no longer listed in WS directories, how do I find them as easy and conveniently as they found me?

Joe

You can easily and quickly get pretty much the same info off of the ftd and teleflora on-line florist directories. Or you can use search engines or any number of other on-line directories. This is the computer and internet age, you know. It's not hard to find a florist in another town.

My question to you would be what has "how you find "em" got to do with whether you or they should or shouldn't be entitled to ask for or expect the same discount that has been traditional on wire orders? You paid the wire service for that directory. The filling florist got nothing out of it. So . . . if he or she has no real expectation of ever hearing from you again . . . and probably has never heard from you before . . . why should he or she be expected to give you a discount on your wire order any more than the guy who called you direct?

I don't know of any other business that extends a 20% "finder's fee" to a competitor or anyone else who is totally unknown and not likely to ever be heard from again. I find it interesting that members of an industry that struggles so hard for such meager profits (as a rule) is so ready and willing to give up their hard earned profits to competitors and others who offer them nothing to add to their bottom line.

 

[Joe Mioux]

HC....

Like you i don't jnecessarily disagree with your comments. I am just basing my comments on my real world experience.

Since FTD, doesn't let me play in their sandbox anymore (I don't get .com orders, because I don't play nice with them), the vast majority of all my incoming business is from Real Flower shops. I do get a few from Teleflora HQ, and a few from the big nasty O.G.s but nothing significant.

Joe