WS Desperate for filling shops

[hcflorist]

Maybe "Focus" is the problem

I think retail florists need to REFOCUS and do it quickly if they are to survive much longer.

We need to ask ourselves why the biggies like Pro, FTD.com, and TF.com are taking our markets away from us. And there is pretty much just one answer. INTERNET SALES ! ! !

The ONLY chance we florists have of competing with that is butting heads directly with them IN OUR LOCAL MARKETS on the INTERNET with well run, well stocked, and continually updated WEBSITES directed at OUR LOCAL MARKETS and designed to OUTCOMPETE those guys in our markets.

We can talk about what we do for walkin business, our service, our value, and our "professionalism", etc. all we want. Fact is, John Q. Consumer could care less, as evidenced by the statistics. What he wants to see is an attractive, user-friendly store on his computer with competitive prices that is there and easy to find when he wants it and needs it. He's ordering everything over the internet, including pizza. Why would anyone think he would go out of his way to look for a B&M store for flowers?

The biggies are throwing millions of dollars at internet marketing. But they're spreading it across the entire world. So they're pretty thin in many local markets. Local florists are largely ignoring and missing out on the opportunity to effectively compete against these guys in their own local markets on the internet. It can be done and it's probably what most of us need to be focusing on. Cause that's where the .coms are most effectively kicking our butts. Why else would we call them ".coms"?

Any local florist who doesn't have or is not seriously looking at getting a high profile local internet presence complete with storefront and shopping cart up and running RIGHT NOW should probably be looking for something else to do.

So while I agree that anybody who fills for a competing OG is probably an idiot who shouldn't even be in this business, I think we should be focusing on how to most effectively market to our local customer base and sell more flowers rather than on how to block sales by OG's.

 

[Eric S]

Customers still want the same criteria for $50, $150, $750, and $15000 desings.

There just isn't enough of those types. At least until there is less shops to choose from.

Look I have gone from every end of the spectrium from suppling suppermarkets to filling hundreds of orders a month with FTD and 800. Sending a quality product is more profitable. But I still don't see the answer to the question at hand.

Lori your right there is nothing wrong with catering to the 20 or 25 bud vase. We do it all the time.

But right now we are seeing a major slow down and we need to wait out this slow down until it passes. Offering the consumer a resonably priced product is a must. Take a look at what 800 and ftd are emailing. They are lowing their prices because they have the same problem we are. I am not saying match but give the consumer something to still keep the intrested in the local flower shop.

 

[bloomz]

consumers "shift" their spending power to the areas that they are comfortable with!!

And that's exactly why I cringe when I our industry gets negative press in any way shape or form. I just can't seem to get why some seem to revel in it.

opinions, your know

I think retail florists need to REFOCUS and do it quickly if they are to survive much longer.

We need to ask ourselves why the biggies like Pro, FTD.com, and TF.com are taking our markets away from us. And there is pretty much just one answer. INTERNET SALES ! ! !

The ONLY chance we florists have of competing with that is butting heads directly with them IN OUR LOCAL MARKETS on the INTERNET with well run, well stocked, and continually updated WEBSITES directed at OUR LOCAL MARKETS and designed to OUTCOMPETE those guys in our markets.

We can talk about what we do for walkin business, our service, our value, and our "professionalism", etc. all we want. Fact is, John Q. Consumer could care less, as evidenced by the statistics. What he wants to see is an attractive, user-friendly store on his computer with competitive prices that is there and easy to find when he wants it and needs it. He's ordering everything over the internet, including pizza. Why would anyone think he would go out of his way to look for a B&M store for flowers?

The biggies are throwing millions of dollars at internet marketing. But they're spreading it across the entire world. So they're pretty thin in many local markets. Local florists are largely ignoring and missing out on the opportunity to effectively compete against these guys in their own local markets on the internet. It can be done and it's probably what most of us need to be focusing on. Cause that's where the .coms are most effectively kicking our butts. Why else would we call them ".coms"?

Any local florist who doesn't have or is not seriously looking at getting a high profile local internet presence complete with storefront and shopping cart up and running RIGHT NOW should probably be looking for something else to do.

So while I agree that anybody who fills for a competing OG is probably an idiot who shouldn't even be in this business, I think we should be focusing on how to most effectively market to our local customer base and sell more flowers rather than on how to block sales by OG's

I nominate this for post of the week

 

[Bigted]

I think retail florists need to REFOCUS and do it quickly if they are to survive much longer.

We need to ask ourselves why the biggies like Pro, FTD.com, and TF.com are taking our markets away from us. And there is pretty much just one answer. INTERNET SALES ! ! !

The ONLY chance we florists have of competing with that is butting heads directly with them IN OUR LOCAL MARKETS on the INTERNET with well run, well stocked, and continually updated WEBSITES directed at OUR LOCAL MARKETS and designed to OUTCOMPETE those guys in our markets.

We can talk about what we do for walkin business, our service, our value, and our "professionalism", etc. all we want. Fact is, John Q. Consumer could care less, as evidenced by the statistics. What he wants to see is an attractive, user-friendly store on his computer with competitive prices that is there and easy to find when he wants it and needs it. He's ordering everything over the internet, including pizza. Why would anyone think he would go out of his way to look for a B&M store for flowers?

The biggies are throwing millions of dollars at internet marketing. But they're spreading it across the entire world. So they're pretty thin in many local markets. Local florists are largely ignoring and missing out on the opportunity to effectively compete against these guys in their own local markets on the internet. It can be done and it's probably what most of us need to be focusing on. Cause that's where the .coms are most effectively kicking our butts. Why else would we call them ".coms"?

Any local florist who doesn't have or is not seriously looking at getting a high profile local internet presence complete with storefront and shopping cart up and running RIGHT NOW should probably be looking for something else to do.

So while I agree that anybody who fills for a competing OG is probably an idiot who shouldn't even be in this business, I think we should be focusing on how to most effectively market to our local customer base and sell more flowers rather than on how to block sales by OG's.

All this sounds good, but I think it glosses over some of the really slimy things that some OGs are doing now. It's easy to say get a great website and compete with them. The reality is that most shops don't have the money or expertise to do that.

 

[CHR]

If you have a few extra minutes, please view this video of Seth Godin discussing why being remarkable isn't an option.

One his first points is to explain that consumers are bombarded with choices and they have less time to digest them.

So they opt for 'easy' - like the one-stop-shop of FTD.com, ProFlowers or 1800flowers.com.

Do they love these companies? Not even close - based on the marks earned in consumer ratings sites. (PF seems to come out they best since they don't give complainers the run-around, but they earn plenty of complaints.)

The problem with us locals is there is no one-stop where consumers can easily order direct all the time. They need to visit multiple sites, type in their contact info and CC multiple times and save their reminders in multiple sites - if they want to patronize local florists for each order. They really have to work at it.

There's a fundamental mind-set difference between 1) believing that local florists are ultimate the best value for consumers and 2) believing that 'my' company is the best choice regardless of what the consumer wants and where the flowers are to be delivered.

#1 doesn't address the companies that need a one-stop shop and #2 really isn't different than a national OG.

IMO what's needed is #3 - the one-stop, one-wallet, one-reminder place to see and order products from local florists in local markets across North America.

Then we'd have a purple cow.

 

[hcflorist]

All this sounds good, but I think it glosses over some of the really slimy things that some OGs are doing now. It's easy to say get a great website and compete with them. The reality is that most shops don't have the money or expertise to do that.

That's not a reality. Any shop that is pouring money into wire service membership can easily afford an effective website and can afford to effectively compete against the OG's with it in their local market. If they can't, they'd better start figuring out their exit strategy.

All they've got to do is be willing to spend as much time developing a web presence and maintaining it as they spend trying to keep dying concepts alive. And they need to stop talking about stopping OG's from kicking their butts in their own markets while they continue to do everything they can to get those orders so they can get a check from a wire service.

The sad but real "reality" is that any shop that can't afford an effective internet presence in their local market or lacks the expertise to make it happen or hire it done had better look for something else to do. Cause their ship has already sailed.

 

[lori042499]

That's not a reality. Any shop that is pouring money into wire service membership can easily afford an effective website and can afford to effectively compete against the OG's with it in their local market. If they can't, they'd better start figuring out their exit strategy.

All they've got to do is be willing to spend as much time developing a web presence and maintaining it as they spend trying to keep dying concepts alive. And they need to stop talking about stopping OG's from kicking their butts in their own markets while they continue to do everything they can to get those orders so they can get a check from a wire service.

The sad but real "reality" is that any shop that can't afford an effective internet presence in their local market or lacks the expertise to make it happen or hire it done had better look for something else to do. Cause their ship has already sailed.

This statement is only necessarily true of those that pay for a WS membership and do not recoup their money spent with orders sent and/or filled. If they are recouping that money and/or making a small profit with said WS, if they quit they will no longer have that income or that bill and it is a null issue. The money spent on WS cannot be considered when figuring this equation because with out the ws the income from said ws is no longer there, the same for the expense. So if the flower shop drops the WS, they only have the income that comes in daily from local customers to use as a guide on how much money they have to market with. If they are struggling to keep open with a ws they will be struggling after they drop the WS....

 

[Bigted]

That's not a reality. Any shop that is pouring money into wire service membership can easily afford an effective website and can afford to effectively compete against the OG's with it in their local market. If they can't, they'd better start figuring out their exit strategy.

All they've got to do is be willing to spend as much time developing a web presence and maintaining it as they spend trying to keep dying concepts alive. And they need to stop talking about stopping OG's from kicking their butts in their own markets while they continue to do everything they can to get those orders so they can get a check from a wire service.

The sad but real "reality" is that any shop that can't afford an effective internet presence in their local market or lacks the expertise to make it happen or hire it done had better look for something else to do. Cause their ship has already sailed.

I barely know how to respond to this. Seems like a lot of bitterness towards the wire services. Lots of florists do make money from their wire service membership - me included. And yes, they do things that really upset me, but quitting would be foolhardy. Maybe you don't make money from them, and if you don't you should quit.

Also, while I agree that every shop should have a site, and work at keeping it attractive, a good OG will get better rankings 75% of the time.

 

[Chezbloom]

Why would a a "Good OG" get better rankings %75 of the time?
Can't we as individuals better target keywords etc for our areas than OG's who claim to deliver to all four corners of the earth?

 

[theRKF]

Why would a a "Good OG" get better rankings %75 of the time?
Can't we as individuals better target keywords etc for our areas than OG's who claim to deliver to all four corners of the earth?

Chez, that's true - but I think what he was referring to was that "good OGs" tend to be prolific online marketers and that 75% of florists with websites don't yet have the financial ability or SEO skillz to compete in that arena.

Ryan

 

[CHR]

Well it's much easier for webmaster-OGs to work on sites when they don't have to deal with the day to day stuff like filling and delivering orders. They don't know flowers but they do know the web.

I was looking at how floristone.com spammed with way to the top of many cities this holiday and it's an interesting mix of social network spam, paid links and blog comment spam. WesleyBerry's path has been a bit different, but still involves F/T webmaster, paid articles, paid links and tens of thousands of inbounds from self-owned sites.

Any florist here would do well to spend some funds with Ryan (a professional SEO and SEM) to get their site moved up. You can read how to do it here all day long, but my experience is that few (sadly, very few) actually implement the suggestions and follow through well.

As much as we talk about consumers struggling with DIY flowers and getting in over their heads just to save money, we should apply similar lessons to ourselves and site optimization.

 

[Sher]

There are at least two FC boardies here that make cost effective web site...Ryan is one and Clay is another. I have a site with Clay ...it is less than 600 bucks to get up and running...next year he is offering more templates and he works very hard at keeping things current. If I can put my own pictures on for Thanksgiving and have a better holiday than we have had for years then ANYONE can operate this site.I know Rich at the Fountain Valley Florist has a site with Ryan...I do not know the costs but Rich maintains his along with guidance from Ryan....and Rich is AIFD but not a computer guru....althou he is smarter than me.
SO THE PROBLEM OF AFFORDABILITY IS REMOVED

There are several floral directories out here in the Flowerchat Nation....one is Art's. www.localflowershop.com..I pay for the top version...it takes me three orders to re-coup my costs...it works, it works and it works somemore.Three orders to recoup my yearly cost...yep three orders...ok four if you want to factor in WS costs or whatever.Last year that directory produced over 2500 in business......I never touch it..Teresa at Beneva does all the work...

Mlou has www.ILocalflorist.com
This site brings in orders weekly as well....I have had it longer than Art;s so it has made me more money ...It cost me 50 bucks a year to be listed.....I do nothing to this as well so none of my time is invested..except to take the orders that come in...and I do not give a hoot if her daughter is the defaut florist...sign up and fill the spot in your town...same with Art's.

There is also www.locateaflowershop.com...I'm on there as well...this is one directory that does not seem to have a system to let me know when I get business from the...the other two are much clearer....but I won't drop it....no way.It does not require my time either....
But the point is that each one of these locations brings me business, along with my silly articles I write that are on Rich Dudleys www.floristblogs.com Every email I send to ANYONE has my link to my floristblogs at the bottom...each time I send a joke it gets passed around...or each time I connect with a new corporate client or use email to send a proposal to a bride...it is in their face...
Each of you who are sitting back could do all of these under a 1000 bucks...use your plastic if you have too for cryin out loud but get your shop out there for the public to see...and if you get an order going somewhere that you don't go to...take it anyway..sorry but that is the truth...as long as we do a professional job...the consumer rarely gives a hoot if you are in their backyard or not....this is why they use FTD etc....they think they do a good job...take charge of your business and take ftd's/tf/800's/pf etc business back from them by doing it better. You are a REAL Florist answering the phone NOT an operator...that is worth it's weight in gold.
Last week I had a lady call from out of town wanting an item she saw on TF.com...told her I had seen the candles they were using and was so unimpressed by the value/cost that we decided not to carry items from them anymore but that we had a beautiful centerpiece that had "whatever" in it...sold it at 64.95 plus delivery. She said...I sure wish I could use you for my Aunt in NJ...sold that also, picked up the phone before I sent the florist the order checked it out with her and she was glad to get 64.95 plus del on her c./p's that she was selling for 59.99...this is how it works...you have to get the business in...if you keep hidden in the closet and worrying about what the big guys are doing while doing nothing...well the writing is on the wall for you. NO ONE holds the power you hold by being a Real Florist...NO ONE. Don't mean to offend but each of us can get our business back with very little effort...and I hope we are not talking about this very same thing next year...I hope we have all pulled together and "walked our talk"....not just the few here that have been doing it for us over the past three years or so but all of us.
Sher

 

[David]

There is also www.locateaflowershop.com...I'm on there as well...this is one directory that does not seem to have a system to let me know when I get business from the...the other two are much clearer....

Good advice. I see locate provides click data. I am not aware of the other two provided data. Can you explain?

 

[Sher]

Good advice. I see locate provides click data. I am not aware of the other two provided data. Can you explain?

Not sure how it is done...but I can check my stats on my website daily, from one time frame to another or hurly where my visitors are coming from and each order that comes off the website...for the most part tells you the url ( i think ) of where the order was generated...you'd have to speak with Clay on this one...
Sher

 

[hcflorist]

This statement is only necessarily true of those that pay for a WS membership and do not recoup their money spent with orders sent and/or filled. If they are recouping that money and/or making a small profit with said WS, if they quit they will no longer have that income or that bill and it is a null issue. The money spent on WS cannot be considered when figuring this equation because with out the ws the income from said ws is no longer there, the same for the expense. So if the flower shop drops the WS, they only have the income that comes in daily from local customers to use as a guide on how much money they have to market with. If they are struggling to keep open with a ws they will be struggling after they drop the WS....

I can't help anybody who's stuck in that train of thought. They're probably doomed anyway.

Regardless, my post had absolutely nothing to do with wire service pros and cons. I simply stated that if you can come up with the bucks it takes to afford to belong to a wire service, it's pretty ridiculous to claim that you can't afford a working and effective web site.

I barely know how to respond to this. Seems like a lot of bitterness towards the wire services. Lots of florists do make money from their wire service membership - me included. And yes, they do things that really upset me, but quitting would be foolhardy. Maybe you don't make money from them, and if you don't you should quit.

Also, while I agree that every shop should have a site, and work at keeping it attractive, a good OG will get better rankings 75% of the time.

You don't need to get defensive with me about your WS memberships. My post had absolutely nothing to do with the WS pro/con argument. And I'm not about to get drawn into that argument although I agree that people who don't make money from them should quit. Trouble is, all too many people in this business have no idea whether they're making money and have no clue how to tell if they are.

My point, once again, was simply that if you can afford to be in a WS, there's no reason you can't afford a good website . . . PERIOD ! ! !

And I don't agree that a good OG will get better rankings 75% of the time. It may be true that OG's are currently getting better rankings in all too many markets. That's obviously because very few florists are actually putting real storefront websites up, much less actually using them as competitive tools. And I don't count the WS websites as real storefront websites for most of the florists who never even look at them once they're up, much less maintain them or effectively promote them.

OG's wouldn't be kicking local florists butts all over the web if all of those florists who insist on refusing to change would get their butts in gear 2007 style, get themselves a good website, and start putting it to work competing against these guys in their own local markets. As opposed to spending their time, money, and resources working for those guys, enabling and abetting them, and, in fact, keeping them in business.

 

[stormy]

I agree with fox, we MUST fill the needs of each and every customer. Other florist say, " i start my arrs at $50.00", well whoopdeedo, how about that little old lady who has $25.00 to spend. Are we too high and mighty that we turn this order down? not me, send em all to me...

 

[goldfish]

We may not be able to compete with their prices alone...

Actually, we can compete. Easily. The only thing is that we won't make a whole lot of profit if our prices are similar to theirs.

But the real question is: do we really need a huge profit from these sales? Not really. As long as these sales are incremental and cover the cost, you don't necessarily need to make a profit. We once talked about this loss leader concept a while ago.

 

[hcflorist]

I agree with fox, we MUST fill the needs of each and every customer. Other florist say, " i start my arrs at $50.00", well whoopdeedo, how about that little old lady who has $25.00 to spend. Are we too high and mighty that we turn this order down? not me, send em all to me...

Ditto and Ditto and Ditto

 

[clay]

Order "URL Referrer"

Not sure how it is done...but I can check my stats on my website daily, from one time frame to another or hurly where my visitors are coming from and each order that comes off the website...for the most part tells you the url ( i think ) of where the order was generated...you'd have to speak with Clay on this one...
Sher

Yea, it is really neat to see exacly how the customers found us on the "URL Referrer" listing on each order. Here are several that I copied from our www.mcadamsfuneralflorist.com website orders;

http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=ro...exas&fr=yfp-t-471-s&toggle=1&cop=mss&ei=UTF-8

http://www.google.com/search?q=flor...-us&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&startIndex=&startPage=1

http://www.google.com/search?source...29,GGLG:en&q=funeral+homes+in+victoria,+texas

 

[Twila]

My friends have expressed my own opinions...

what happens to the sender of that order...do they now reach our for something else other than flowers like a drop ship item of chocolates or fruit. How do you combat that alternative gift delivery when they cannot get their flowers delivered. I am concerned that we may be shooting ourselves in the foot trying to save our industry but I don't have an easy answer. ..and for now getting rid of them is not the answer but it is tempting at times.
Sher

I certainly want to keep people ordering flowers from me. I don't want them going to the "alternatives"

Maybe florists should believe the hype. The statistics show that floral sales at florist shops have not risen for a few years now. That means that when you factor in inflation, sales are falling.

I think florists are so blinded with not filling wire orders that they are losing the consumer. Look at FTD and 800Flowers and Proflowers, these corporations are increasing their direct shipped sales. Those sales are sales not going to florists.

I can see not filling orders for ordergatherers, but by limiting the consumers choices to send flowers to family and friends, can backfire. We should be spending more time working to make sales grow instead of putting roadblocks on the flower buying public.

If we put up "roadblocks"...they'll find someone who doesn't. Someone else with give them what they want...why not us---the REAL FLORIST?!

consumers "shift" their spending power to the areas that they are comfortable with!!
If you run a well rounded florist business, chances are, you'll be the survivor B&M shop in your area, HOWEVER, more and more consumers are really time deficient, and will spend their money at the most convenient places, SO, if YOU make it easy for THEM to buy at YOUR shop, YOU will get the sales.
We have NO CONTRACTUAL REQUIREMENT to fill OG orders, so, fill them at your own peril.
Large OG operations like 1800, FTD, ProFlowers, have HAD to turn to direct shipping, because SO MANY REAL FLORISTS have refused to fill for them, and they KNOW that, so are finding other transport methods.

Well said...make it easy for them and they'll buy from us. If you don't want to fill fof someone else, (namely a DOG), then that's your choice. The big guys are becoming so successfull obviously because we are letting them do so by not informing our customers of just what we can do for them. If all you want to do is fill orders for your local market and customers (meaning that you don't want to take care of their wire service needs)...SEND THEM TO US--WE'LL TAKE VERY GOOD CARE OF THEM! But instead, why not let them know that YOU can be the "Full Service Florist"? First, you need to educate them of what that means.

I plan to be one of those SURVIVORS! We are working better at being one of those "well rounded" businesses.

In order to be successful you have to give them what they are looking for. The original poster is a member of FTD. I agree that wire service specials are sometimes out of touch with practicality, but consumers still want these types of floral gifts. And to say that the health of our industry hinges on us not giving the consumer what they want is crazy. Now I am not saying fill orders for ordergatherers, but if those orders could only be purchased and filled by real florists, then they lose.

And the consumers willingness to purchase gifts other then flowers is real. And if we don't get with the program that they, the consumer, demand, then we will disappear, not the ordergatherers. FTD, 800Flowers will still be selling dropped shipped items, we will be the ones with empty shops wondering where did all the customers go.

Tons of people are ordering these specials!! There must be a demand for them--Do ya think?

The problem with us locals is there is no one-stop where consumers can easily order direct all the time. They need to visit multiple sites, type in their contact info and CC multiple times and save their reminders in multiple sites - if they want to patronize local florists for each order. They really have to work at it.

This is one reason that we have MAS. We tell our customers that they will not have to give their information to us again once they have ordered from us. We keep a list of all the people and addresses and what they have sent in the past, along with their info. All they need to do is give us their phone number and we go from there...EASY FOR US AND EASY FOR THEM.

There's a fundamental mind-set difference between 1) believing that local florists are ultimate the best value for consumers and 2) believing that 'my' company is the best choice regardless of what the consumer wants and where the flowers are to be delivered.

#1 doesn't address the companies that need a one-stop shop and #2 really isn't different than a national OG.

IMO what's needed is #3 - the one-stop, one-wallet, one-reminder place to see and order products from local florists in local markets across North America.

[/quote]

Again, if you let them know (communication) that you can definately help them with their out of town orders...they won't go elsewhere. Our customers are loyal--if they know what you offer. We can do this either verbally or with our own websites, and/or both.

get your shop out there for the public to see...and if you get an order going somewhere that you don't go to...take it anyway..sorry but that is the truth...as long as we do a professional job...the consumer rarely gives a hoot if you are in their backyard or not....this is why they use FTD etc....they think they do a good job...take charge of your business and take ftd's/tf/800's/pf etc business back from them by doing it better. You are a REAL Florist answering the phone NOT an operator...that is worth it's weight in gold.
Last week I had a lady call from out of town wanting an item she saw on TF.com...told her I had seen the candles they were using and was so unimpressed by the value/cost that we decided not to carry items from them anymore but that we had a beautiful centerpiece that had "whatever" in it...sold it at 64.95 plus delivery. She said...I sure wish I could use you for my Aunt in NJ...sold that also, picked up the phone before I sent the florist the order checked it out with her and she was glad to get 64.95 plus del on her c./p's that she was selling for 59.99...this is how it works...you have to get the business in...if you keep hidden in the closet and worrying about what the big guys are doing while doing nothing...well the writing is on the wall for you. NO ONE holds the power you hold by being a Real Florist...NO ONE. Don't mean to offend but each of us can get our business back with very little effort...and I hope we are not talking about this very same thing next year...I hope we have all pulled together and "walked our talk"....not just the few here that have been doing it for us over the past three years or so but all of us.
Sher

Ditto...Ditto...Ditto.

All my friends have shared my views here....well said! Again, if we aren't part of a wire service and fill for affiliates-whoever WE choose those to be, how can we expect another florist (across the nation) to fill and do a good job for us?