WS Member Numbers
- Thread starter BOSS
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Teleflora: 25913 records, 411 new, 1243 removed and no longer members.
Net loss of 832 shops/listings or 3.2%
Net loss of 832 shops/listings or 3.2%
6% is quite a few. However, it has been mentioned before that the current "plan" is to get to a much smaller number of shops and try and maintain most of the coverage. OR, maybe that's not the plan as much as the inevitable.
Keep in mind those numbers include our Canadian friends. The number in the US 50 states is closer to 11K. I couldn't catch the exact total as the new directory was loading. No wonder I am getting more and more "rej by wire service" messages.
Does the FTD number include their supermarkets? I thought there were 4000 or so grocery stores with membership.
TOTO
New Member
No BIG SURPRISE, ey?
The question all of us must ask ourselves regarding our continued so called partnership with any of these FORE PROFIT COMPANIES is:
WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR MEE LATELY?
Since they have FAILED to make our cash registers ring with the consumer's 100% sales and only offer us the highly discounted run it through their wringers labor and $ervice intensive side of the order spectrum coupled with their expected FREE DELIVERY $ERVICE feature from our shops, their fat lady has sung her last tune.
Had the good fortune to meet up with a local florist who I haven't seen or spoken to in years. We did the usual complaining, after which, she admitted that, her accountant had just informed her of HOW MUCH MONEY she was loosing on the THREE WIRE SERVICE COMPANIES she has.
She's trying to decide which two she wants to dump for now and wonders if she will even participate with just one.
I congratulated her for having a SMART ACCOUNTANT who crunched her numbers to arrive at DA TRUTH since most of them are either lazy or clueless when it comes to taking the time to reconcile a wire service statement.
Suffice it to say that, they have SPOOKED THE HERD and the stampede to get out from under them has just begun.
The question all of us must ask ourselves regarding our continued so called partnership with any of these FORE PROFIT COMPANIES is:
WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR MEE LATELY?
Since they have FAILED to make our cash registers ring with the consumer's 100% sales and only offer us the highly discounted run it through their wringers labor and $ervice intensive side of the order spectrum coupled with their expected FREE DELIVERY $ERVICE feature from our shops, their fat lady has sung her last tune.
Had the good fortune to meet up with a local florist who I haven't seen or spoken to in years. We did the usual complaining, after which, she admitted that, her accountant had just informed her of HOW MUCH MONEY she was loosing on the THREE WIRE SERVICE COMPANIES she has.
She's trying to decide which two she wants to dump for now and wonders if she will even participate with just one.
I congratulated her for having a SMART ACCOUNTANT who crunched her numbers to arrive at DA TRUTH since most of them are either lazy or clueless when it comes to taking the time to reconcile a wire service statement.
Suffice it to say that, they have SPOOKED THE HERD and the stampede to get out from under them has just begun.
Do the Teleflora numbers include Canada as well? What I don't understand is the last census report in 2002 had about 22000 florists...is every florist in Teleflora?? I know at least one that isn't...ME.
Len @ Hofmann Florist
Len @ Hofmann Florist
Eric S
Demoted Webmaster
So does that blue list of removed and added shops getting thicker or do they still manage to keep it under 5 or 6 pages?
Yea... LOL...
Back in the day... Bad Bobby's day that is, it was his plan to operate with about 7900 members if I remember the number right. He said that 7900 could cover 90% of the zips...
But thats ass-u-ming they would all be willing to receive
Explain please
I'm confused. Maybe you guys can explain.
First, many of the past strings of posts about FTD alluded to the fact that FTD made money from it's florist side of the business?
If that is true, why would you allow that side of the business to erode?
Wouldn't you want to maintain high membership numbers?
Are the number of flower orders passing thru FTD dropping that fast that they can afford to let membership continue to slip?
Is FTD's direct ship program doing that great that they no longer need florists?
I can't understand how they can let their membership numbers continue to slip like this? I mean all those dollars from monthly fees, all those fees, their cut of the credit card processing, the money made from Mercury, the money made from hosting websites, these are big dollars and by letting florists slip away, they are dollars lost.
To me managment would being trying to grow membership, not let it slip away?
I'm confused. Maybe you guys can explain.
First, many of the past strings of posts about FTD alluded to the fact that FTD made money from it's florist side of the business?
If that is true, why would you allow that side of the business to erode?
Wouldn't you want to maintain high membership numbers?
Are the number of flower orders passing thru FTD dropping that fast that they can afford to let membership continue to slip?
Is FTD's direct ship program doing that great that they no longer need florists?
I can't understand how they can let their membership numbers continue to slip like this? I mean all those dollars from monthly fees, all those fees, their cut of the credit card processing, the money made from Mercury, the money made from hosting websites, these are big dollars and by letting florists slip away, they are dollars lost.
To me managment would being trying to grow membership, not let it slip away?
To try and answer your questions.......The whole thing began waaaay back when FTD ( then a member owned corp ) had the option to sell FTD ( The profit producing part ) to a private firm called The Perry Group.
FTD split into two depts. The for profit section - called FTDI and the member-owned section - Called FTDA. The for profit section included marketplace, a beginning fresh flower program, the Logo use, etc. The member owned controled membership, shop inspections, conventions, etc.
Due to "irreconsileble differences" ( yes, I am being nice ) between FTDA and FTDI, FTDI and FTDA dissolved the partnership - FTDA tried to re-organize into the Extra-Touch Florist Association. Since then, FTD has decided that just serving it's member florists is not profitable enough and all the fees, the dOG's and even their dOG all are intended to build profts for FTD corp.
What it ultimately boils down to is that FTD Corporation is out to make the money directly for themselves.....by circumventing the member florists whom they view as backwards individuals and that we aren't a profitable venture.
Hope this answers your questions.......bearing in mind that I am not a shop owner, just a loooooong term veteran of this industry.
Joe Mioux
Well-Known Member
EEEEEEWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!,
Where have I heard that before!
hmmm, a Bob, where are you?
Joe
P.S., Oh yea, it doesn't matter anymore, I'm not FTD.
You've asked the million dollar questions.
This is purely speculation and conjecture on my part: Green Group had no intention of holding onto FTD this long. (It's been openly shopped around for more than a year now.) They have tried different approaches to goose the numbers but none seem to be sustainable business models.
They didn't count on Bloomnet morphing into a full-blown wire service and taking a chunk of their florist business. They didn't take care of basics by letting the Merc Network fail during a critical holiday - and then basically tried to first appease, then blow off, then throw bones to florists they damaged.
The cash grab scheme with WebLoyalty and Interflora has backfired royally.
Based on the email marketing campaigns I receive, they're hanging their hat on 'cheap'.
They are now testing a fixed price take-it-or-leave-it sending system on florist.com that will either further weaken the fillers of finally prompt them to say 'no more'.
For florists chasing after fillings, 1800 has far more company orders (and OG orders?) flowing through their system.
What is 'the brand' today? To consumers (especially the ones under 40) and to florists?
In short, sfox, I don't see a long-term vision. It looks like they're just chasing last quarter's comparison numbers in order not to show a decrease in profits.
Added: And they're losing members so they better figure out a way to put a positive spin on it 'cuz the truth could damage their stock price/sale price.
David
Well-Known Member
Idle thoughts
With almost twice the shops paying dues it should help Teleflora Order gathering business. Every day it seems teleflora calls trying to place a 29.99 total order. No doubt already rejected by another member. They like 800 and FTD are going after this low end order. From you flowers also pushes this price point.
Once again with more shops paying dues they may be able to improve there tech and catch back up to FTD. This would put more pressure on FTD member numbers.
I think with so many orders being direct shipped FTD is trying to create orders to keep members. With florist.com and florist express they hope to accomplish this and also go after flowers sent today who took all there orders to 800
With almost twice the shops paying dues it should help Teleflora Order gathering business. Every day it seems teleflora calls trying to place a 29.99 total order. No doubt already rejected by another member. They like 800 and FTD are going after this low end order. From you flowers also pushes this price point.
Once again with more shops paying dues they may be able to improve there tech and catch back up to FTD. This would put more pressure on FTD member numbers.
I think with so many orders being direct shipped FTD is trying to create orders to keep members. With florist.com and florist express they hope to accomplish this and also go after flowers sent today who took all there orders to 800
CHERYL BAKIN
New Member
Today, with consumers, there is no loyality!! Everyone who is under 35 uses the almighty web, and buys on the basis of LOW price only.
IMO that's why FTD doesn't care about the florists. They will drop ship it if they can. Fill thru a florist if they have to.........
Remember, the Proflowers guys changed the perception of the consumer from that of "flowers have to be delivered today" to "it's OK if she gets them tommorrow.". Pro flowers has taken on FTD and has come out a winner.
Unfortunately, FTD is again behind the 8-ball.
Since the focus of everyone is on the Earnings reports only, there is no loyality anymore to the florists who fill the orders, or give a crap about the product that is delivered. Its a game of percentages and numbers.
What's the probability thof an order being filled to satisfaction?
What's the probability that a consumer will complain or... ask for a refund? What's the most amount of refund we will have to give to a consumer, and how often? It's statistical analysis....probability and statistics....and it's played and studied everyday by every major player in the flower business.....especially at FTD right now. (Think Las Vegas, and other games of chance).
The florists only choice is to drop them like a hot potato, and keep on dropping them.
Eventually, FTD will get gobbled up by someone else (1-800 or TF or ??) How soon this will happen depends upon many things, among them how much money the Leonard Green people are willing to throw to the wind in the continuing downward spiral of FTD. Propping up the stock price and other numbers is a ghost game that can be seen thru without too much difficulty. they have never bluffed well.
and this is High stakes poker they are playing right now.......
I just have to shake my head and feel bad.....it WAS a great thing at one time!
Regards,
Cheryl
IMO that's why FTD doesn't care about the florists. They will drop ship it if they can. Fill thru a florist if they have to.........
Remember, the Proflowers guys changed the perception of the consumer from that of "flowers have to be delivered today" to "it's OK if she gets them tommorrow.". Pro flowers has taken on FTD and has come out a winner.
Unfortunately, FTD is again behind the 8-ball.
Since the focus of everyone is on the Earnings reports only, there is no loyality anymore to the florists who fill the orders, or give a crap about the product that is delivered. Its a game of percentages and numbers.
What's the probability thof an order being filled to satisfaction?
What's the probability that a consumer will complain or... ask for a refund? What's the most amount of refund we will have to give to a consumer, and how often? It's statistical analysis....probability and statistics....and it's played and studied everyday by every major player in the flower business.....especially at FTD right now. (Think Las Vegas, and other games of chance).
The florists only choice is to drop them like a hot potato, and keep on dropping them.
Eventually, FTD will get gobbled up by someone else (1-800 or TF or ??) How soon this will happen depends upon many things, among them how much money the Leonard Green people are willing to throw to the wind in the continuing downward spiral of FTD. Propping up the stock price and other numbers is a ghost game that can be seen thru without too much difficulty. they have never bluffed well.
and this is High stakes poker they are playing right now.......
I just have to shake my head and feel bad.....it WAS a great thing at one time!
Regards,
Cheryl
Confused sfox... you... I've never known you to be, and I take your reply as a tongue in cheek response (I hope). You are one of the many that has a good grasp of reality!
Like any other business, they have no control of their "customers" habits. Simple answer.
I am curious though, I wonder if the decline in WS membership somehow relates to the rise in membership of the FlowerChat Nation, based on percentages
Personally I do not think Green will ever find a buyer, unless they have a fire sale. It would have happened by now based on their numbers, but keep in mind, based on the stock out there, that any potential buyer will be funding millions in retirement dollars to the many crooks at the top of the dog pile. I agree, I do not think they wanted to hold FTD this long, it was supposed to be a 2-3 year...get in-gut it-cash out...didn't happen.
And I'd bet **part** of the reason buyers are beware is all the chatter we do on our blogs and elsewhere... Wall Street IS watching...we KNOW that!~
TOTO
New Member
Ditto on the NOT CONFUSED part..................
Yes, SFOX always seems to ask the hard questions Mark.
In my opinion, none of them ever had a clue as to just what they had purchased, either Perry Capital, and now Green.
They both seem to have been all caught up in the BUY and FLIP scenario rather than building upon a brand which was once great when it was a member owned and operated co-operative.
So sad and TOO BAD since, when they EXLUDED their own member florists from the FORE PROFIT SIDE OF THE SPECTRUM rather than including them, everyone would've been able to make some serious profits.
While Perry lucked out by finding a buyer who gave his investors almost a 400% return on their investment, Green will not be that fortunate.
As to the holdouts and just why they still stay, and as they have continued to tell us: Well I'm still making money on DA BRAND which is why I insist on PAYING THE PIPER.
Must be something like the BATTERED WIFE SYNDROME, ey?
Confused sfox... you... I've never known you to be, and I take your reply as a tongue in cheek response (I hope). You are one of the many that has a good grasp of reality!
Like any other business, they have no control of their "customers" habits. Simple answer.
I am curious though, I wonder if the decline in WS membership somehow relates to the rise in membership of the FlowerChat Nation, based on percentages
Personally I do not think Green will ever find a buyer, unless they have a fire sale. It would have happened by now based on their numbers, but keep in mind, based on the stock out there, that any potential buyer will be funding millions in retirement dollars to the many crooks at the top of the dog pile. I agree, I do not think they wanted to hold FTD this long, it was supposed to be a 2-3 year...get in-gut it-cash out...didn't happen.
And I'd bet **part** of the reason buyers are beware is all the chatter we do on our blogs and elsewhere... Wall Street IS watching...we KNOW that!~
Yes, SFOX always seems to ask the hard questions Mark.
In my opinion, none of them ever had a clue as to just what they had purchased, either Perry Capital, and now Green.
They both seem to have been all caught up in the BUY and FLIP scenario rather than building upon a brand which was once great when it was a member owned and operated co-operative.
So sad and TOO BAD since, when they EXLUDED their own member florists from the FORE PROFIT SIDE OF THE SPECTRUM rather than including them, everyone would've been able to make some serious profits.
While Perry lucked out by finding a buyer who gave his investors almost a 400% return on their investment, Green will not be that fortunate.
As to the holdouts and just why they still stay, and as they have continued to tell us: Well I'm still making money on DA BRAND which is why I insist on PAYING THE PIPER.
Must be something like the BATTERED WIFE SYNDROME, ey?
Chezbloom
Well-Known Member
quote: The florists only choice is to drop them like a hot potato, and keep on dropping them.
Agreed.
I wonder how long it would take for FTD to die if all the members simply quit today? I mean, could they even drop ship stuff for the prices they expect florists to fill orders for? Hmm
Agreed.
I wonder how long it would take for FTD to die if all the members simply quit today? I mean, could they even drop ship stuff for the prices they expect florists to fill orders for? Hmm
Any clue on the amount of change (plus or minus) with BMT? I'd like to publish a little post about these numbers in the blog.
Yes, Boss
Yes,Boss I am confused. As a businessman I would want to have every florist paying me dues and fees every month. If you take the premise that FTD really doesn't care about it's florists, why would you drive them away. Wouldn't you want as many as possible paying you?
During this time you would be making money hand over fist. You wouldn't really care if they sent or recieved any orders because you were making money just having them as part of your group.
Yes,Boss I am confused. As a businessman I would want to have every florist paying me dues and fees every month. If you take the premise that FTD really doesn't care about it's florists, why would you drive them away. Wouldn't you want as many as possible paying you?
During this time you would be making money hand over fist. You wouldn't really care if they sent or recieved any orders because you were making money just having them as part of your group.
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