FTD.com changes

[LJVF]

Most of us have seen the statistics, pie charts and graphs of ProFlowers domination for this past Valentine's, but I think it's important that we re-visit this, to emphasize what we're dealing with. Below is a pie-chart of percentage of purchase by retailer (big 4). The piece of the pie that proflowers consumed is quite scary and there's no evidence that their slice won't get bigger.

No wonder FTD is moving in this direction. This is very bad news for the traditional retail florist, let's face it, there is no way that our slice can feed all of us.

Here is a link to the full blog article: http://blog.compete.com/2009/02/25/valentine-flower-proflowers-1800flowers-ftd-teleflora/

 

[PhillyPhlorist]

I think the biggest decision to make is this.

Are we (independent florists) going to promote boxed flowers as gifts?

As many of you know, I have no problem with promoting wrapped bunches of flowers for cash & carry. People buy these products for themselves, not as gifts; therefore, I believe, they won't cannibalize our core business, which is the delivery of gift flowers.

Promoting boxed flowers as gifts most likely WILL compete with our core business. It's a completely different animal.

Let me put this way...

Imagine at the rose section on your website, you give two options for your customer: $60 - pre-arranged, $35 - in a box. If people choose the latter (I suspect many would), our profit will go down. No doubt about that.

Dilemma is... if we don't do this, ProFlowers and FTD will eat us alive, because they are going to capture ALL the market of boxed flowers.

Neither seems good.

One word.

Dollars.

The margins aren't there for florists or FTD when it comes to local delivered boxes. Look at the product content and drop-shipped price points. Realize FTD is shipping all those items out of one location so the economy of scale and efficiency of production is far, far superior to most any local flower shop.

The only way to go cheap is to cut out the middle man, and in this equation, that would be the local florists.

Interesting idea Herb, but I don't think the dollars are there...

See, you're missing my point: There is a STRONG value for SAME-DAY delivered product. If we were to ADD this product line to our mix, we could get a piece of this market. Yes, one would have no choice but to partner with FTD on this, but is that a TOTALLY bad thing? Possibly for those shops emotionally set against and just plain angry at FTD...

I am not FTD-cheerleading here, just thinking outside the box (pun intended). You would NOT go cheap here. You would have to charge accordingly.

BTW, Goldie - do you not charge anything for designing the flowers in the box? You wouldn't just plop them in there and slap on the lid and a pull-string bow!!! You would DESIGN the flowers IN the box - nicely displayed, according to colors, size, shape, etc. Fold the tissue paper nicely, attach a fine store label... In my shop, you buy a $60 vase or a $60 box, you get the SAME number of flowers. (box & bow costs MORE in some cases than the dang vase these days!) Labor time is nearly identical. Roses = classic example.

Ok, there is CLEARLY a market for DIY boxed flowers - that has been established. The only thing (I can see anyway) we florists have and THEY don't is our same-day delivery service. If the "program" is set up properly, and made special via a codified box, with proper costing, this COULD be a win-win for FTD and the Retail Florist.

This would NOT work for some shops, as their minimums would not allow the prices set to be used. The shops that could do such a program would have to have a well-established delivery system in place (a pool possibly, or an efficient delivery system), be able to handle a 3-1, 2.5-1 markup on COGS, a reasonable labor rate, and be able to deliver the quality. FTD on the other hand, would have to price accordingly for SAME DAY service, possibly pass on more $$ in the form of a increased allocated delivery charge (HOW MUCH does the FedEx overnight shipping cost the CONsumer???), and provide the codified box at a REASONABLE price, in reasonable quantities.

Yea, all this a stretch, but doable if all sides were dead-serious about taking a bite out of PF...

- H.

LASTLY... if FTD won't do this, I'd bet someone else might try...Bloomnet. Think about it for a moment.........

 

[BOSS]

Yes, one would have no choice but to partner with FTD on this, but is that a TOTALLY bad thing? Possibly for those shops emotionally set against and just plain angry at FTD...

Do you really want an answer to that rhetorical question?

Gimme a ring today if you have time...

 

[LJVF]

If we florists decide to offer DIY bouquets, why do we have to sell them in a box? The only reason ProFlowers does this is because they are forced to drop ship them. FTD is doing the same thing except in a fancier box to make it look more like a gift.

Here's what I think, there is a market for DIY and a market for gift giving. We can offer the DIY, but package it similar to Oberer's "Roses in the Raw".

On the other hand, I truly believe that the gift giver would prefer to send a florist designed arrangement as opposed to a disassembled box arr, it's the perceived price that's swaying them to the box. These customers are placing more value on price than presentation. But I'm talking local delivery, drop shipping as an alternate to wiring out an order is a whole different ball game. I think that's where Randy was going with his "shippables" idea.

I like this brainstorming, great thread.

 

[CHR]

Darrell -

I'm not convinced those Compete.com numbers reflect what actually happened over the holiday. The poll results SAF published after V Day showed fewer consumers purchasing from national companies. (See chart below.)

The biggest gainer was the supermarkets category and I'm convinced that was as a result of price.

I do believe PF pulled the largest market share in 'national floral service' segment for the holiday for 3 reasons:

1) They out-advertised everyone else. We spotted their TV commercials on CNN and a number of channels targeting men. The commercials were very well done and full of testimonials from happy customers. They were also all over the web - everywhere.

2) They promoted low, low prices. Most ads touted $19.95 - far lower than other national companies (even though once all the fees were added in, their costs were at or above other merchants.)

3) Their website product images are by far the best. They fill the thumbnails with over-flowing vases to make each arrangement look huge.

PF is owned by a media company so they have benefits of better ad placements at lower costs than their competitors. They also have far more partners - QVC, Expedia, DirecTV, Priceline, etc... FTD hopes to leverage their common ownerships (NetZero, Juno, MyPoints, ClassMates.com) to drive traffic to their company, but the quality of that traffic would seem to pale in comparison to PFs partners.

So are customers enamored with a pretty gift box (which will easily cost a local florist more than a vase) or are they seeking low prices with promises of quality (7 day guarantee)?

IMO, it's the later, not the former.

 

[LJVF]

Darrell -

I'm not convinced those Compete.com numbers reflect what actually happened over the holiday. The poll results SAF published after V Day showed fewer consumers purchasing from national companies. (See chart below.)

These numbers only reflect the share of the pie between the big four.

So are customers enamored with a pretty gift box (which will easily cost a local florist more than a vase) or are they seeking low prices with promises of quality (7 day guarantee)?

IMO, it's the later, not the former.

I tend to agree, see my previous post.

 

[CHERYL BAKIN]

I really think that Herb is onto something.

We used to sell a lot of flowers, delivered daily, in boxes or loose wrapped.

We got away from that....and I'm am not sure why.
Keep designers busy? Trying to provide better or more attractive gift to our consumers? Just not sure....

My point is: again something that JB said in another thread, TF, FTD and PF, etc spend a whole pile of $$ on surveys, consumer feed back, tracking trends, etc. They do the research.

Research says......consumers are spending $$ to buy flowers in boxes -- without fancy vases -- without high priced designer labor.

Why should we not find a way to capitalize on this? It's time for us to get our heads out of the sand, and give the consumer what he/she wants -- not what we want to sell them!

We are in a recession......I want to sell flowers! --- by any means possible!! Moving product in volume can be a way to survive.If FTD won't sell the boxes (Herb is making that call on Monday)....maybe someone else will!


I'm gonna check around on Monday also.

Just my Humble Opinion......
Cheryl

 

[CHR]

Cheryl,

Boxes are not popular in our area for several reasons:

1) Heavy cardboard boxes trap heat and moisture and can degrade rather than enhance the flowers. They can be like little greenhouses.

2) All the flowers here need to have a water source since our humidity level can hit a very low 10%. Tubing or bunching and placing in a water bag takes as much time as designing them.

3) Many of our recipients are not at home and porching the bouquets leaves us open to complaints. The unarranged bouquets sent to businesses can and do elicit calls asking 'why wasn't this delivered in a vase?'

A couple other things to consider:

4) PF and other drop shippers are paying .20/rose (or less) so when they replace, they have the margins to easily do it.

5) We'll need photos of beautiful arrangements that don't arrive the way they're displayed, too to compete in 'look and feel' dollar for dollar with the drop shippers.

I'm not saying that boxing is impossible, just that in warm climates, it can create headaches - especially for low-priced items. With razor thin margins, replacements (and complaints) negate the benefit.

Our market may be more conducive to a French wrap, but we will still need to call first to make sure the recipient is home - so the economy of scale in delivery will likely go out the window.

 

[Chezbloom]

I don't believe there is a huge demand for boxed flowers. I have to agree with everything Cathy posted above. And, I do believe that most purchasers don't know that they are sending a boxed arrangement that looks nothing like the picture. Its marketing overkill. How many PF purchasers are return purchasers? I'm not sending a box of flowers to anyone. And that is the big difference between us and them. Where on that pie chart was the independant WS free local florist. I like pie, where am I? We did ok for Valentine's day. If we quit WS that support PF and dropshipping the future will be either drop shipped boxes or beautifully arranged flowers. The choice will be simple and we will have more pie. Ramble ramble ramble...:scooter:

 

[sandytf]

This is a great thread. Almost every post has made me think about something new or a different perspective.

I keep trying to put this all in a larger perspective. I try to compare the floral industry to other industries that have seen the same changes. It seems that since the advance of the internet, many retail industries have seen huge changes in the way customers do business with them.

Take the furniture and home accessory industry. Years ago there was no Pottery Barn, Ballard Designs, and the gazillion other catalogue and online outlets for this type of product. There were maybe some larger chains but mostly independent, local furniture and home stores. I'm sure there are a lot fewer now then there once were. The same could be said for a lot of other types of retailers as well (such as independent book stores)

I have to wonder whether the local independent florist really CAN compete with all the other competition out there? Certainly not on the national level that big national companies do. Sadly, I think that we simply are going to see less and less independent florists. The ones that do survive will be the ones that focus on their local customers and markets. They will fill a niche that is needed in their local markets and do it better than anyone else can. There will always be some need for people to walk into a store and be able to touch and smell the flowers. There will always be some need for quality, creative design. There will always be some need for same day, hand delivered service. There will always be some need to be able to shop in store where they know your name and tastes.

The question I see is: How much is some? For sure, less than there is now.

Should the local, independent florist try to follow what the big nationals are doing? Or, should they focus there $ and energy on showing their own local customers where the value lies in their product and services? I definitely believe that some changes are needed to stay relevant. I only hope that the changes that the independent florist makes are the right ones to insure their survival. I think websites are extrememly important, but let's be honest, the national chains are always going to have more money and technology to be steps ahead of what the independent can do.

To go back to the Pottery Barn example: I don't think the independent furniture/home decor stores that have survived did it by putting all their product on a website and hoping their customers would shop with them the way they shop with Pottery Barn. They probably did it by continuing to offer good interior design, a product mix that appealed to their local market, a showroom where customers can actually come in and sit in a sofa and know how comfortable is before they buy it, etc.

Every retailer has to change as the times change. We need to offer some different price points and make shopping more convenient. But let's not get so caught up in the battle between the big guys that we lose our identity and what really makes us relevant to our local customers-which is probably different for each and every one of us depending on our local markets.

I would still love to see a national advertising campaign that extolls the value and benefits of what the local florist can do vs. the OG or drop shippers. I think there's starting to be a swing in the American psyche back towards loca shopping. It's just starting, but it's there.

One other thought: Have any of you really promoted the delivery of hand-tied bouquets? It's sort of a hybrid between "designed" arrangements and "loose" flowers. It could be promoted as a "green" initiative as well since many people already have vases and don't really want to accumulate more.

 

[master J]

I really think that Herb is onto something.

We used to sell a lot of flowers, delivered daily, in boxes or loose wrapped.

We got away from that....and I'm am not sure why.
Keep designers busy? Trying to provide better or more attractive gift to our consumers? Just not sure....

My point is: again something that JB said in another thread, TF, FTD and PF, etc spend a whole pile of $$ on surveys, consumer feed back, tracking trends, etc. They do the research.

Research says......consumers are spending $$ to buy flowers in boxes -- without fancy vases -- without high priced designer labor.

Why should we not find a way to capitalize on this? It's time for us to get our heads out of the sand, and give the consumer what he/she wants -- not what we want to sell them!

We are in a recession......I want to sell flowers! --- by any means possible!! Moving product in volume can be a way to survive.If FTD won't sell the boxes (Herb is making that call on Monday)....maybe someone else will!


I'm gonna check around on Monday also.

Just my Humble Opinion......
Cheryl

The reason why these companies are successful is because they are decieving the customers and sucking them in with a low price....I think it's a disgrace.

Think outside of the box, and stop trying to copy what the big 3 are doing.....I don't care if they spend millions on research, we all need to do our own thing to be successful and stop looking at what the big guys are doing, it won't work for the local florist! Just my humble opinion...

 

[bloomz]

See, you're missing my point: There is a STRONG value for SAME-DAY delivered product. If we were to ADD this product line to our mix, we could get a piece of this market. Yes, one would have no choice but to partner with FTD on this, but is that a TOTALLY bad thing? Possibly for those shops emotionally set against and just plain angry at FTD...

LASTLY... if FTD won't do this, I'd bet someone else might try...Bloomnet. Think about it for a moment.........

Love it! And love that you're not letting anti wire passion overrule plain ole good business sense.

I really think that Herb is onto something.

We used to sell a lot of flowers, delivered daily, in boxes or loose wrapped.

Why should we not find a way to capitalize on this? It's time for us to get our heads out of the sand, and give the consumer what he/she wants -- not what we want to sell them!

We are in a recession......I want to sell flowers! --- by any means possible!! Moving product in volume can be a way to survive.If FTD won't sell the boxes (Herb is making that call on Monday)....maybe someone else will!

Cheryl

Absolutely!

Cheryl,

Boxes are not popular in our area for several reasons:

But do you show them? (We don't)

Somewhere I've heard repeatedly that line "You have to show it to sell it".

This is a great thread. Almost every post has made me think about something new or a different perspective.

Me too, great brainstorming.


Should the local, independent florist try to follow what the big nationals are doing?

Been my philosophy for a very long time - follow the leaders.

Every retailer has to change as the times change. We need to offer some different price points and make shopping more convenient. But let's not get so caught up in the battle between the big guys that we lose our identity and what really makes us relevant to our local customers-which is probably different for each and every one of us depending on our local markets.

I would still love to see a national advertising campaign that extolls the value and benefits of what the local florist can do vs. the OG or drop shippers. I think there's starting to be a swing in the American psyche back towards loca shopping. It's just starting, but it's there.

Teleflora is trying, but not for our benefit

One other thought: Have any of you really promoted the delivery of hand-tied bouquets? It's sort of a hybrid between "designed" arrangements and "loose" flowers. It could be promoted as a "green" initiative as well since many people already have vases and don't really want to accumulate more.
GREAT thinking

Makes me think of what we see on UK websites - nice packaging of basically wrapped flowers. Totally not our US style but obviously totally do-able.

I'll have to study them a bit more, but aren't many of them sort of boxed flowers without a lid on the box?

If we florists decide to offer DIY bouquets, why do we have to sell them in a box? The only reason ProFlowers does this is because they are forced to drop ship them. FTD is doing the same thing except in a fancier box to make it look more like a gift.

I like this brainstorming, great thread.

I can a bit visualize a marketing campaign designed to leverage this. Something like this perhaps?

http://www.blumebox.com/products.shtml

As much as we all want 800TFTD to fail - they're doing many things we need to be doing. On this one they're certainly trying to shoot where the ducks are flying.

Coffee time - yee haw.

Think outside of the box, and stop trying to copy what the big 3 are doing.....I don't care if they spend millions on research, we all need to do our own thing to be successful and stop looking at what the big guys are doing, it won't work for the local florist! Just my humble opinion...

Master J - in a word - baloney.

Just my not very humble opinion.

Rock on...

 

[master J]

Bloomz, You want some cheese with that baloney??!!That wouldn't be Kosher!

 

[Bigted]

We are in a recession......I want to sell flowers! --- by any means possible!! Moving product in volume can be a way to survive.If FTD won't sell the boxes (Herb is making that call on Monday)....maybe someone else will!
Cheryl

Cheryl, last week I specifically heard the head of FTD say that they would make the new FTD boxes available to florists that wanted them. They may not have the procedures down yet, but the intent is there.

 

[LJVF]

I can a bit visualize a marketing campaign designed to leverage this. Something like this perhaps?

http://www.blumebox.com/products.shtml

As much as we all want 800TFTD to fail - they're doing many things we need to be doing. On this one they're certainly trying to shoot where the ducks are flying.

Indeed they are and we florists cannot afford to turn our heads the other way whenever there is adversity and/or a paradigm shift. The numbers don't lie, boxed flowers are here to stay and they aren't gonna go away. "Change" is a part of life.

Remember when the internet was a foreign word to most? Well those that changed their thinking and boarded that train are reaping the benefits. Those that didn't, well as you always put it JB, the train left them at the station.

It really boils down to this question, what is it that is attracting more and more consumers to this shift in flower buying?

Marketing is one component, the appeal of DIY is another, but I really do believe that perceived value and pricing is the main one.

 

[Chezbloom]

Spiral standing hand tied

Well actually a really nice spiral hand tied bouquet, (you know, the kind that can stand up by itself) would be very cool delivered in a box.
Possibly a lined box with a small amount of water would work fine. The Bloombox for this would be about the same price as a vase so thats not really a savings. But we can make our own easily. So I am taking back my statement of never sending a box of flowers. I was typing before thinking. We do send out doz Roses in boxes from time to time but all with tubes etc and its as much work as arrangeing in a vase. Bottom line for our store is that it would save only the cost of the vase so it would be for that customer that truely has too many vases already and does not want one. But it could be enough of a savings to work. Just not the thrown in a box DYI kit.

 

[CHR]

We carry the Blumeboxes and they are adorable. BUT, they are not more economical than a vase like a C999 and the plastic liners do get pierced with stems, ruining the box. They also have to be handled carefully in delivery since they can get dinged or dirty.

The upside is they come in a very fun color assortment, are made of recycled wood products (a big plus for 'green' consumers) and hold a hand-tied very nicely.

If you guys are interested in putting together a BlumeBox special for M Day, I'll shoot it and share.

A couple different themes come to mind:

"Granola Grannie" (Lavender box, bright fillers, an herb like rosemary, bear grass and a few pale pink gerbs or similar)

"Fun/Young Mom" Compact in 6" Lime green box with hot pink, lime green & orange seasonals.

The taller ones are more impressive IMO, and lend themselves well to mono-floral drop-ins trimmed with ribbon.

 

[bloomz]

Excellent idea Cathy!

Tried to green you but it won't let me.

I really think we COULD do it as well as they do and maybe even better- can you spell same day???

 

[BOSS]

Cheryl, last week I specifically heard the head of FTD say that they would make the new FTD boxes available to florists that wanted them.

So then all you need is a nice sticker with good adhesive to cover up the FTD logo?

Are you folks thinking of these for local delivery sales? I might sell 10 dozen a year in a box and they are all from the same customer.

I think the appeal to the consumer for PRoF and FTD is the price point.

It would be interesting to know how many units Real Florists could generate. Then one would think they could be sold under a brand like Real Local Florist or something. Real Local Florist could consign with a bouquet maker to do the packing/shipping with all orders flowing into one location. At that location they would have the partner florists information on hand and generate individual logo'd cards and shipping labels on site.

 

[CHERYL BAKIN]

CAthy:
Thanks for the offer to design & shoot....Your photos are always first class.....I'm in.

We carry the Blum-boxes - we use them to deliver our hand-tied wedding bouquets in. Sometimes plain, sometines trimmed with the ribbon color that matches the BM dresses. We have found this to be more effective than delivering in glass vases.

I think the consumer is PRICE DRIVEN in these tough economic times.

I also think that you have to think like a YOUNGER consumer -- most do not want fancy, arranged flowers. How many brides have you talked to that want "no greens in my bouquets, or centerpieces, please -- just flowers" or "Make them look natural -- like you just gathered them up in a big bunch for me" (that was just today).

The point is that the YOUNGER consumer PERCEIVES ARRANGED flowers as stodgey & old fashioned. The want more a more casual look. They want to grab something on the way home, or at the supermarket, with the oranges and the chicken. Their perception does not make it right -- it just means that we have to adapt to what our consumer is wanting to purchase with $$$$.

We tracked it at Valentines day. We sold more boxed roses this year than in the last 8 years. Our price for boxed vs arranged was only $10.00 difference......and our rose price was not outlandish.
What this told me was that the consumer still wants to buy -- they just are picking a less expensive way to spend their money.

We also had many more pickups on Friday and Saturday for Valentines Day than in several years. Again, the consumer is watching $$ -- they got them on the way home.....and delivered them themselves. (and our delivery charge is $8.95).

Cathy, I get what you are saying about heat, and flowers needing water. We also struggle with this in summer months.
i am not giving up, tho, and saying that I will not deliver flowers in a box just because of heat and humidity.....we will find a way to make this work!

Thanks guys for the great ideas!!

Cheryl