Question re: florist education programs

[shannonlovesflowers]

Missy,

Being a board member, I must say that many florists have no idea what it takes to pull of a program, the money, the time the planning...Our board of 5-6 volunteers many one person shops, work on every aspect of planning the programs...we apporoach the eholesaler, organize the procurement of good for the designer making sure they have waht they want, print signs, order eals, organize who is coming who is prepaid who is not, make sure contracts are correct, negotiate contracts, help the designer, set up the program, break down the programs, drive sometimes 2 hours away 2-3 days in a row before the program to get the designer to and from the work area and hotel. Organize meals for the designer. Then we schlep all the designs around the program...We have been trying to get more volunteers because the same 5-6 people doing all the work plus personal life and shop gets to be alot....but working with the designers is so worth it...you can learn so much more this way, not to mention it really gives you a sense of what it takes to do any kind of production...

I sometimes want to take a leave of absence from the board just to sit and watch the program from the audience, but if I quit and the others quit, then there will be no programs...so I sacrifice for the few who care deeply about education...I have found that many florists and this is not all just a great many, those that do not do demand without ever realizing the depth of what others have done to bring the offer to them....so many florists are lazy and want everything handed to them and never think about what goes into anything behind the scenes and who makes all of these thing even possible...Being a volunteer is a thankless job by our peers, partly because many do not know what we put into it in the first place...that would be our own fault for not letting them know...I think I will make a point to change all that...I will be president soon so I will have the power to change and set precedents.

OR......

New blood is railroaded into an association and once the new blood gets there the 3 key people of an "association" (give me a break) wants nothing to do with hearing new ideas or letting anyone that doesn't worship the ground they walk on give any input at all. They want all the control and really treat their "inferior" board members as "subjects" rather than intellegent, talented designers who have tons to contribute.....

Just another reason why I'm over the biz.

KUDOS to any board member who truly wants to bring newbies into any association and listens to it's members (board members and association members) rather than bark orders at them or treat them as if they don't matter.

I have seen really good Floral associations such as OFA, CRFA and FAR, and from what I've seen and heard about Michigans association- it's a good one too...... and I've also seen really tyrannical ones that shall remain nameless.

 

[Rhonda]

Missy, when I was on the TF board here in Maine, our "show" monies came from unit dues. We had XXX amount of $$ to work with to put on a design seminar. We utilized wholesalers show rooms and had a strict budget to work with. Headquarters kept close tabs on the $$ spent and we needed every dollar to show in some sort of receipt to get the money. If you don't have Units that pay dues, then you would not meet the education budgets. If you do have Units and each unit member has dues taken out of their clearinghouse (once per year, I believe) then TF has kept education monies from you? (not sure how TF Canada works but maybe you need to look into developing Units?)
And yes, non-TF members were invited at a higher entrance fee...

 

[Kristine]

#1 Central locations. TF Michigan unit only presents on the East side of the state - 3+ hour drive one way. Not during the week and at night.

#2. Show what can sell. Yes, big showy designs are WOW< but then scale it down and show the same piece (smaller size) so yes, you can do this and sell it in your store.

#3 Push the designers to show a list of what product was used in each design, so that we CAN price the piece against our pricing to get a real idea of the cost. I get really tired of designers that present work and can't tell you the amount of product in that design. How many of us get to do that ON THE JOB. Everyone has to document stem count or are designing by a recipe. I dislike those florist who always ask "how much would that cost" because everyones costs are different, BUT if you had a recipe of what was used, you could price it yourself.

#4. Mechanics. If you are presenting new trends, product. Show and tell us HOW you used it. Especially design shows where the designer is not working in front of the audience. Example, if you are weaving wire into the work, take a piece and show us how you formed it or have the wire piece available for us to look at. Not everyone is mechanically inclined, but the mechanics are what truly makes the work shine.

I love the idea of internet, video classes, that you can download and view on your own time and perhaps with a forum question and answer board that you can post pertinent questions and get answers.

I try and watch Hitomi on accent decor as often as I can, watching several time to perfect the technique. Internet/Video is where its at

 

[Victoria]

The point is, shows in Canada, in high concentration populated areas, should be part of the floral scene in wireworld. The wire services take the money, and don't provide equal educational programmes for the Canadian members.

Do the dues from the Canadian members go towards funding the education programmes in the States? Just wondering.

V

 

[lori042499]

I will ask and try to find out. I am friends with my regional rep and she is very friendly with Rich Salvaggio, I would imagine that we can get an answer to this..

 

[lori042499]

Ok made the call, waiting for an answer...

I asked if there was a education program in Canada and if there is does it work the same way as america's and if not, what is the reason behind not having one...

 

[OB1]

I totally understand the difficulties of volunteers pitching in to host a program in their area.

I was one of only 4 people who brought the first and only AIFD program to Canada, and the work to do that was unbelievable. Like wise, I have happily helped out at various wholeasalers over the years to bring shows to our area, and I will continie to do so in the name of education for both us older florists, and for the good of those coming along.

I guess I am confused about the TF sponsored programmes....seems to me that if a portion of our dues is set aside for education, it should be allocated to somewhere outside of Oklahoma.

To travel there from here is easily over 1000$ airfare, with hotels on top, and of course, like everyone else, I have to factor in days out of the shop, and paying staff to attend. I do not mind paying for education, and, truthfully, many of my staff would probably pay their own way, but THAT IS NOT THE ISSUE!!!

I do not question the value of the programme, or the continuing value to the participating shops.
Rather, I question why the education programmes should be slanted to assist those who are geographically closer to the education center, and as a logiical result, why those of us who are further from Oklahoma are penalized for living further away from the Education Center.

I have flown thousands of miles for education, ( ie Holland, Germany, Switzerland) however, that was a personal choice, over and above any dues to various organizations that I belong to.
.
Like any wholesaler programme, or for that matter, any wholesaler cash and carry sale, I think that the benefits to geographically closer shop far outweigh the benefits to those of us who are located further away, and that does not seem to be equitable.

This has nothing to do with whether I pay for the travel myself, or whether my employer pays for it, nor does it have anything to do with how many design awards I have won, or have not won. (after all most of us here can name many awards that we have won)

In my opinion, this is a discussion about the equibility of the available educational opportunities of members, all of whom chip in to create an education component of the service. Seems to me it should be fair across the board, and not slanted to any one geographical area over another.

I feel like I have been @@@@@ing about this forever...OK not forever, but a good 35 or 40 years....I just have a problem with the largest population centers having exclusive access to to educational opportunities, and then the smaller areas being slammed for not being able to provide the high end services and flowers that the market demands.

Maybe if we thought 2 steps ahead, most of these troubles could be avoided.
JP

 

[lori042499]

OK as far as TF programs are concerned...There are 36 units across the us- most larger states have 2-4(like tx) units and some smaller states have one unit for many(like new england)....These units run programs in and around their states as seen fit by the volunteers that organize them. These programs are funded by the dues portion of your TF statement I believe it is 25.00 twice yearly, but I am not 100% on that. I am going to assume that where there are no canadian units this is not something that is offered in Canada and that none of you pay this special dues fee for the programs(I am currently waiting on the facts to this situation). I will also venture a guess that there are logistical, monetary, legal or liability issues regarding why Tf does not do programs in Canada, maybe it has to do with the designers leaving the country or insurance covering them, I am not sure, maybe Nicole can find this out...

Oklahoma is the TF education center, it is their school...They are part of the same department of TF but the only thing they have in common are the designers that are used for classes. The school is run by TF for TF not by volunteers and not by units...You pick a class pay for it and get yourself there...The units do all give scholarships for the school, our unit gives 2 a year, one that TF provides the money for and one that we(the unit volunteers collect raffles and sell the designers arrangements at auction for). The programs differ from the classes in that the programs you watch and you need to learn by trying out different things on your own, the classes are just that hands on classes that you get taught step by step how to's by the same designers that provide the programs..you get a whole lot more out of the classes in terms of learning...

I hope this clears up some of the different education paths that TF provides...and I hope I got most of it right..

 

[shannonlovesflowers]

You'd fly to Germany but not to Oklahoma? huh, interesting.

The funniest (strange not haha) is hardly anybody from Oklahoma attends those classes.

Look, go there or don't. Belong to TF or don't.
Everyone has the same opportunities (meaning you can go or don't) and we all have from time to time financial struggles.

I'd like to go to Phils school, but again I'd have to travel. I'd love to go to design 358 classes (in Canada no less), but I'd have travel. I'd like to go to Leanns school, but I'd have to travel.
I'd like to attend an AIFD symposium but I'd have to travel, and pay waaaaayyyyy more than I would to go to any of these schools.

I never hear anyone crying about how Symposium is always in a major metro and we all have to travel to get there. Same principal- You pay your AIFD dues and do your CEUs every year to stay in the club, what's the difference?

And BTW, ANYBODY Can attend the TF education center, you don't have to own a TF shop or work for a TF shop....Seriously everybody has the same chance of going...Whoever pays first for any given class wins the seat.

And BTW- Bacon and cinnamon roll day is awesome.

 

[theRKF]

I also love attending design shows, but there are virtually none offered in my area. The last one held in the Ottawa area was 5 years ago, and it was sponsored by a wholesaler. I don't think TF has ever held ne in this area at all.
So my dilema is the logistics of driving for a minimum of 5 hours to attend. That means only two designers can go to any given show, because even if it's hld on a Sunday, you need to stay overnight one night.
So, I would like to see shows presented in some of the smaller cities, ( City of Ottawa has just under 1 million people, and no shows here?!?) and not only in the USA, but also in Canada. We pay the ws fees too.
JP

Makes me long for the days of $69 flights each way Toronto - Ottawa. I used to do day trips to visit clients.

 

[theRKF]

Nicole,

I've never been to a US TF event, so I don't know if there is a blend of design & business in one event or not. That would, indeed, by my suggestion. Have someone other than a WS VP talk about online marketing (pls know - I'm not being dismissive, but I've rarely heard them offer anything relevant or useful at any conference I've attended).

When we ran the Floral Summit in 2008 we had parallel tracks running through the day. Four sessions on online marketing, four on marketing strategies, four on business & sales ... and highlighted by some guy named J (who was awesome!).

Sadly, Floral Summit '09 was killed by the sale and relocation of our major sponsor and host. We looked at working with Flowers Canada's show, but it never came together that year ... then FTD cancelled CFC. We tried to make some noise about having the florists take back the OFC conference but didn't much of a hearing.

TF does have a big opportunity in Canada to be a the hero by bringing either regional or the national conference back to life. FlowerChat will help as much as we are able.

Online training is a nice idea, but there's a reason J stopped charging for the JTV episodes. I'm glad he's found a successful business model that lets him continue producing good content.

 

[lori042499]

Ryan, I have tried to have business realated content within our programs and they are the very least attended programs, florists don't want business programs. They are like trying to sell good news, just won't happen, but a picture of Brittney spears in a drug induced coma is worth millions...Althought they need the business programs badly, they would rather scoop their eyeballs out with a spoon...silly florists!

 

[BOSS]

TF does have a big opportunity in Canada to be a the hero by bringing either regional or the national conference back to life. FlowerChat will help as much as we are able.

I'd take that a step further... Teleflora has the opportunity to be the hero across North America... but alas they would have to dump their OG stable and....

Oh hell, never mind, I digress, I said I would not harp on wire service issues as I see them in the month of July... I'll be back to normal in August...

 

[Victoria]

Shannon, again, the point is, the Canadian members pay dues to the wire services... just like the Americans. Those dues should provide the same opportunities within our borders as well.

V

 

[Rhonda]

Shannon, again, the point is, the Canadian members pay dues to the wire services... just like the Americans. Those dues should provide the same opportunities within our borders as well.

V

As with TF, V, members can also pay "Unit Dues" (it is an opt out if you want) and those Unit Dues go to the Unit's efforts for seminars/shows.

 

[shannonlovesflowers]

Shannon, again, the point is, the Canadian members pay dues to the wire services... just like the Americans. Those dues should provide the same opportunities within our borders as well.

V

I understand that V-

My point is Oklahoma City is smack dab in the center of The USA. EVERYBODY has to travel to go there. A round trip flight from Durango Colorado will cost about $400 to $500 on priceline.com or expedia.com, etc....
I also checked on RT flights from London Ontario to OKC, only about $125 more.
The dues pay for TF wire memberships, as far as I know education is a seperate entity altogether.
Even if we have a design show come to ABQ we still have to pay to get in.

AND like Lori said it's the association members who make sure those shows happen.

But we were talking about TF education center in OKC. Everybody has the opportunity to go there.

At Hitomis class there were Russians there, people from South America...but maybe they lived in the states, I'm not sure.

 

[VJD]

.
Nicole -

I've often wondered if, (and hoped that) shop owners would make it MANDADORY for each staff member to attend a minumum of 1 educational program a year.

For a simple, local program (Teleflora sponsored, State Association sponsored, etc), the shop would pay admission/registration; I do not think the employees need, nor should expect compensation for their "time".

Get commitments from all your Education Specialists who are shop/business owners, that they implement such a program - all their staff members must attend some type of further educational program once a year. Period.


Bert Ford, Bob Hampton, Darla Pawlak, Gerard Toh, Hitomi Gilliam, Jerome Raska, Jim Ganger, Joyce Mason-Monheim, Kevin Ylvisaker, Lynne Moss, Sharon McGukin, Susan Ayala, Tim Farrell, Tom Bowling, Tom Simmons, Vonda LaFever, Wilton Hardy....


Set a precedence by DOING....(if THEIR staff is required to attend, maybe we'd better require it, too!)


Then promote that fact, they THEY strongly endorse, and require, continuing education:

Have testimonials from names we know, that they endorse such a program - then promote the heck out of those testimonials....


(AIFD could do the same thing - make a requirement of the AIFD membership who own businesses, that their staff members actively participate in some type of education program, once a year.)

Marie Ackerman and Rich Salvaggio can make that happen - they can hammer out the details and guidelines.

Make having that status of "pro-active education required" something to be proud of - special directory listings, etc...

If someone takes a stand and makes education mandatory, our industry can only get better... if we are serious, we'd better GET serious....

oh my - can you tell how I REALLY feel? :redface2:​

 

[lori042499]

Shannon, again, the point is, the Canadian members pay dues to the wire services... just like the Americans. Those dues should provide the same opportunities within our borders as well.

V

V, the unit dues are a separate dues structure. It is not part of the membership fees and not all florists pay into it. My guess is that where Canada does not have units or unit programs, your florists are exempt from this fee. I could be wrong, I hope I am not because that wouldn't be right...

 

[shannonlovesflowers]

.
Nicole -

I've often wondered if, (and hoped that) shop owners would make it MANDADORY for each staff member to attend a minumum of 1 educational program a year.

For a simple, local program (Teleflora sponsored, State Association sponsored, etc), the shop would pay admission/registration; I do not think the employees need, nor should expect compensation for their "time".

Get commitments from all your Education Specialists who are shop/business owners, that they implement such a program - all their staff members must attend some type of further educational program once a year. Period.


Bert Ford, Bob Hampton, Darla Pawlak, Gerard Toh, Hitomi Gilliam, Jerome Raska, Jim Ganger, Joyce Mason-Monheim, Kevin Ylvisaker, Lynne Moss, Sharon McGukin, Susan Ayala, Tim Farrell, Tom Bowling, Tom Simmons, Vonda LaFever, Wilton Hardy....


Set a precedence by DOING....(if THEIR staff is required to attend, maybe we'd better require it, too!)


Then promote that fact, they THEY strongly endorse, and require, continuing education:

Have testimonials from names we know, that they endorse such a program - then promote the heck out of those testimonials....


(AIFD could do the same thing - make a requirement of the AIFD membership who own businesses, that their staff members actively participate in some type of education program, once a year.)

Marie Ackerman and Rich Salvaggio can make that happen - they can hammer out the details and guidelines.

Make having that status of "pro-active education required" something to be proud of - special directory listings, etc...

If someone takes a stand and makes education mandatory, our industry can only get better... if we are serious, we'd better GET serious....

oh my - can you tell how I REALLY feel? :redface2:​

Please explain why a shop owner wouldn't expect to pay for the time of it's employees when they are demanding that they attend such a class.

I do think employees should attend design shows, it is for thier own betterment. But demanding that they go and NOT paying for them to go is thoughtless.

 

[VJD]

.
Shannon -

You've addressed a valid point; one that I've wondered about, and turned over in my mind many times...

I value your input, and would like to know what you, and others, think is fair, to both the employer and employee.

We've already agreed that the registration/admmission fee is paid by the employer. I feel this is fair, regardless if attendance is mandatory, or not.

If attendance at an educational program is a shop requirement, do you think hourly compensation should include:

• Just the design program? However many hours the actual design portion runs?

• The employee hourly wage for the whole evening? (upon arrival, prior to the program; after the program - auction i.e 6:30 - 9:30?)

• Pay the whole evening, plus travel time? (i.e. leave the shop at 5:30, get home at 10:30?)

• A pre-determined number of hours; say, 2 hours? 3 hours?

• Other thoughts or ideas?

.

Please explain why a shop owner wouldn't expect to pay for the time of it's employees when they are demanding that they attend such a class....

...demanding that they go and NOT paying for them (*the time of it's employees) to go is thoughtless.

My explaination in NOT paying/compensating the employee's time for attending, (but paying for the registration fees), is based in part of an overall picture of economical factors, affordability, and employee loyality.

Thoughts of a "compromise" played into the equation. It wasn't meant to come off as "thoughtless".

Honestly, it's funny how two people can see things in such different ways - I mean that sincerely! Sometimes I am blind as to how someone else might view something!

Lesson learned!

Valerie