FTD.com changes

[sandytf]

Let me continue this thread by asking a provacative question?

What methods does Proflowers, FTD.com, Teleflora.com, OG's, d'OG's all do extremely well that we do not.

The answer is not "Generate hundreds of thousands of sales" - THAT IS THE END RESULT.
WHAT do they do that makes that end result possible?

---------------------------------------------------------------

Now, Once you identify the methods they use to generate that END RESULT.....How can we IMPROVE on those methods to bring that END RESULT to us?

IMO, the methods they use are simply advertising and marketing-but at a level that no single shop could ever begin to compete with. They have huge brand recognition. The independent florists (as a collective group) have no brand at all (or perhaps maybe some type of brand that we really don't want to promote such as "expensive")

We spend a lot of time discussing this or that type of product, "designer" or not "designer, and so on. But really none of it means squat if we're each out there trying to do our own thing against the big $ spent on advertising and marketing. We, as independent florists, can only affect our own local markets until we somehow have a united front.

Until we form some sort of advertising co-op or somehow try to form an organization promoting some very specific goals, we're just spinning our wheels. We can have the greatest ideas in the world, but if we don't get the word out, it's totally ineffective.

Quite frankly, I don't see any type of co-op or organization happening because the independent florists are too factioned. I think any group that would start up would want to be too exclusionary to be effective. Not the most positive outlook, but I think that's the current reality.

 

[master J]

IMO, the methods they use are simply advertising and marketing-but at a level that no single shop could ever begin to compete with. They have huge brand recognition. The independent florists (as a collective group) have no brand at all (or perhaps maybe some type of brand that we really don't want to promote such as "expensive")

We spend a lot of time discussing this or that type of product, "designer" or not "designer, and so on. But really none of it means squat if we're each out there trying to do our own thing against the big $ spent on advertising and marketing. We, as independent florists, can only affect our own local markets until we somehow have a united front.

Until we form some sort of advertising co-op or somehow try to form an organization promoting some very specific goals, we're just spinning our wheels. We can have the greatest ideas in the world, but if we don't get the word out, it's totally ineffective.

Quite frankly, I don't see any type of co-op or organization happening because the independent florists are too factioned. I think any group that would start up would want to be too exclusionary to be effective. Not the most positive outlook, but I think that's the current reality.

A united front needs to start somewhere! We need to think long term, I know myself and a lot of younger florists are in for the long haul and something needs to be done about the scum of the industry! We can all educate our customers independently for starters, which I already do. I even try to get through to some florists still calling me with possible TF orders, and I grill them about it too. Are we spinning our wheels? Maybe...but I will stay positive and hope one day things will change in our industry.

To say we cannot stop them is just a negative response, it's like saying your vote for president won't make a difference, or the war on drugs cannot be won.:hammer:

We need to start somewhere!
The more people that quit the Weasel Services, the less fillers they will have. It's just not about refusing OG orders, its about refusing all orders and getting out of the WS all together. Take some risks, and stop being afraid. There has got to be a better way! Times are a changing, get up off your assss and do something about it.

Stay positive:musical:

 

[Carrington]

A united front needs to start somewhere! We need to think long term, I know myself and a lot of younger florists are in for the long haul and something needs to be done about the scum of the industry! We can all educate our customers independently for starters, which I already do. I even try to get through to some florists still calling me with possible TF orders, and I grill them about it too. Are we spinning our wheels? Maybe...but I will stay positive and hope one day things will change in our industry.

To say we cannot stop them is just a negative response, it's like saying your vote for president won't make a difference, or the war on drugs cannot be won.:hammer:

We need to start somewhere!
The more people that quit the Weasel Services, the less fillers they will have. It's just not about refusing OG orders, its about refusing all orders and getting out of the WS all together. Take some risks, and stop being afraid. There has got to be a better way! Times are a changing, get up off your assss and do something about it.

Stay positive:musical:

Without wishing to upset anyone I have to say that as a very young person who still believes 110% there is a future for florists i(albeit in an somewhat aging body) I do wonder if we oldies really allow the youth of our industry to go for it or find it easier to put the negatives over than the positives

For example I took four guests to a florist club dinner the other day - the average age of the club members circa 63, the average age of my guests 33. Not only did the oldies find it hard/impossible to mix with my guests but openly shook their heads during the after dinner chat at the young florists passion, enthusiasm and questioning of the system. And yet all four of my 'youngsters' run successful businesses, are trained, have bsuiness acumen and have the desire to stick with the industry for at least another 20 years.

I read somewhere in another thread is it time to pass the mantle over. I think it is ... in my opinion the best thing we oldies can do is support, encourage and assist the next generation to do things again and again because if all that is ever said is the likes of Proflower etc will just carry on then that isn't going to help anyone.

Yes the big boys will always have market share ... but equally bespoke brands don't all keel over as a result. The concept of a national group of florists working together is not unique but maybe now - given the parlous economy - is the time it will happen and if there is an appetite for it then it should be encouraged to the hilt and I for one would pitch in my time/expertise etc to help make it happen on the basis what worked in the States could easily work over here.

Carrie

 

[sandytf]

Just to be clear, I'm not negative about the future of the whole industry, I just question whether we can become united as a group to combat the big national brands.

I myself am positive about the future of the company I work for as well as our postition in our local market. But this thread has been mostly about the big boys and how they have taken market share. There was a thread a few weeks ago about whether or not to remain members of SAF because a lot of people didn't see it as worth the dues. Maybe not, but then we need something that is worth it and relevant to independent florists.

I truly hope we can all come together and form that organization. It would need a clear vision and mission. It would need people who have exceptional organization skills. Maybe now is the time-we have the internet and email which makes it so much easier to communicate with each other.

I don't consider myself old, either. I'm 43 and have been questioning the "same old, same old" for years now.

Who's up for the challenge?!

 

[CHERYL BAKIN]

What can we do to help ourselves?

(I was tied up for most of yesterday, so sorry for the delay in this reply).

Blaming the economy for the current mess of the floral industry is not an option. The downfall, if you will, has been coming for over 15 years. Yes, the current economy has made things much, much worse. All of us need to take precautions and be prepared for failure. Knowing when to say "enough" is part of smart business. That being said:

And Taking a cue from both the FTD - PF and TF playbooks, here's some ideas that may help improve sales:

1. Purchase products in larger quanity. Take a chance on 250 40 cm roses, or a box of tulips, or lilies, or whatever. Pass the savings on to your customer as a daily special or in some promotion.
Even if it is only 1 product per week....it can help. Right now, there are great quantities of daffs and tulips and other spring product available.

2. Be willing to sell, at a lower mark-up, those loose & unarranged flowers by the bunch or box, or less labor intensive designs that are mono-floral. (thanks Darell -- better word than "dumbed down" )

3. Re-examine your mark-ups on fresh flowers, plants and your labor charges; Take a closer look at your delivery charges.

4. Re-examine your hours of operation and staffing levels. If you are only open from 9 am to 3 pm, you have little hope of catching the loose flower buyer on his/her way home. Staying open until 6, and advertising that you are open until 6 pm, should increase your sales.

5. Market - Market - Market!! A sidewalk, changeable sign costs about $200.00. Flyers can be done on any PC, and printed in quantity at a quick print place. Small weekly flowers to a bank, a restaurant, a hair salon -- let's people know that you are still here & that you have product to sell.

6. Fill ALL orders to value!! Whether it is your local customer, or a wire in -- don't skimp. In doing so, you will enhance the "goodwill" of all florists.

7. Get a web presence -- or a better web presence. If your site does not have e-commerce, get it, and do it now!! A website does not need to be really costly -- and there are many options for webhosting. This is another salesperson, who operates 24/7/365.

and Last, but most importantly,
8. Give the customer what they want -- when they want it -- or be prepared to discuss any problems with them, by phone, in a positive manner, as soon as the order is placed with you. Forget the email crap -- make the personal, phone to phone, connection!!

Be that Floral voice -- be warm and friendly. Thank them first for their order.

Too many customers give us horror tales of orders being held for a day, 2 days or more, and they have no communication with you regarding their order or fulfillment. The biggest mistake that we all make is in communication (or lack of it) with our customers.
If you need to charge extra for a before 10 am delivery, then explain that and give the customer the option of paying the higher charge...or not.

Hope this helps.

Cheryl

 

[goldfish]

Just to be clear, I'm not negative about the future of the whole industry, I just question whether we can become united as a group to combat the big national brands.

The cold fact of organizing people as diverse as florists is that you can't rely on people's good will. Eventually, it all boils down to who pays how much. And everything falls apart.

 

[CHERYL BAKIN]

Sandy....
Goldie hit the nail on the head.

Money talks, and BS walks. (It does in my store also).

that's why we are making changes to hopefully capture some of the things that are talked about in this thread & others).

Getting florists to work together on just about anything is, as a friend said to me recently, "like trying to herd cats in the same direction."
'nuff said.........

Cheryl

 

[Sher]

Why run scared of FTD drop ship...compete with them on your own merits
1. "delivered to your hands...not left at your door"
2. "no hidden charges"
3. option to have "item arranges or delivered in a box for the DIY fan"
4. order upscale rose boxes in black, order a wide roll of gold mylar and line the boxes with that,fold it over as a package would be inside a box, order freezer bags and use two of them in the boxes...have your name imprinted on the freezer bags as well,add a gold label and tie with a gold bow...
5. Do what Cheryl says..order a large box of roses, 40 cm...offer a price point that competes....a standing order can be as low as 20 cents a stem for gorgeous Eucadorian roses...offer mixed colors...for a set price. IRC...FTD does not include filler or greens..if I am wrong...get a price on drop in greens from Janna...not of this requires the ability of a designer...one of my drivers does a gorgeous job..we sell 25 mixed colors for 39.99 in the black box...works like a charm...
6. Quitting may not be the best answer...using their own inability to do what we do might be...they cannot deliver same day...they cannot deliver directly to the hands of the recipient...I CAN AND I DO...I am one of their own worst enemies..I can do what they can't but I will use their marketing to accomplish that...
JMHO....

 

[RWK]

Let's take Sher's comments.....and raise them up a notch.

If FTD has that black paisley print box.....We make our solid, glossy black, If theirs is lined in tissue, we line ours in gold or silver mylar......They use a bit of oasis wrapped in plastic.....We use the oasis, wrapped in several layers of silver or gold....hidden by the wrapping...so that the water source is not seen when the box is opened.....

We select the BEST Flowers.....purchased at a great rate because we buy in a good quantity.....but not only price, but with attention to QUALITY.

Instead of using a postcard with a computer printed note.......We use a hand lettered calligraphy.

WE TAKE WHAT THEY DO.......AND DO IT BETTER THAN THEY DO !!!!!!

 

[Sher]

http://www.800giftbox.com/products/market.cfm?MarketID=2&src=home

This is where we got our shiny black boxes...we got them in two sizes...now I see that they are carrying gold ones..how abut a gold box, black ribbon and black and gold label....just an idea

 

[CHERYL BAKIN]

Sher:

Someone could get the gold or black boxes (plain) from Gift Box. (Usually packed 25 or 50/box)

Just checked pricing on the gift box site. Black, gold and many other colors will require a special order color charge, and a minimum order qty.

However.......Window boxes are available in gold, at no additional charge, as follows:
25 x 3 x 2 1.33 ea qty 50
30 x 5 x 3.5 2.93 ea qty 50
36 x 6 x 5 4.23 ea qty 25

Buying them plain as a trial, and then tying with a black bow, and using your own label would work just fine.

I'll bet that Shawn at San Antonio Press or Gay at John Henry Company could make a snazzy label for anyone, at a pretty reasonable price!

Cheryl

 

[bloomz]

Let's take Sher's comments.....and raise them up a notch.

If FTD has that black paisley print box.....We make our solid, glossy black, If theirs is lined in tissue, we line ours in gold or silver mylar......They use a bit of oasis wrapped in plastic.....We use the oasis, wrapped in several layers of silver or gold....hidden by the wrapping...so that the water source is not seen when the box is opened.....

We select the BEST Flowers.....purchased at a great rate because we buy in a good quantity.....but not only price, but with attention to QUALITY.

Instead of using a postcard with a computer printed note.......We use a hand lettered calligraphy.

WE TAKE WHAT THEY DO.......AND DO IT BETTER THAN THEY DO !!!!!!

Now you're talking about using that edumacashun and design talent!!!

RIght on Reekie!!! :iwuvyou:

Who says design talent has to be exclsively flowers?????

Designing attractive packaging I'm sure is an Art as well.

 

[bloomz]

Ya know, the more I think about this the more I am realizing this is a serious as a heart attack. Not to sound more alarmist than that last sentence but we may be witnessing the notso slow death of arranged flowers and/or the florist.

7 years ago before TF went consumer direct I asked one of the big dudes there about it and he said and I quote "What else can we do?"

How long do you think they're going to ignore that boxed flowers had more sales than the other 3 gorillas combined for VD? (and that's ignoring the percent of FTD AND 800 selling boxes as well)

I see right now 3 choices - figure out howto leverage this like Cheryl, Sher, Goldie, and (finally) Rickie were just saying and do it better than them...

Or - move to a warehouse or your garage and be their filling station...for those occasions when they need same day delivery...

Or, look for new jobs.

Well I'm too old to look for a new job, and my motorcycle takes up too much room in my garage.

This has been an awesome brainstorming thread - I think I stumbled on a goody here.

Not particularly good news, but vital news.

Ignore it at your peril.

 

[RWK]

I disagree about the death of arranged flowers - I think there will always be occasions and times that arranged flowers will be purchased.

Boxed flowers, loose bunches, euro-styled handtieds are additional sources that we should utilize in a chaging market

Will every single bride want to do her own flowers? Will a grieving family want a box of flowers for the casket ? Will Mrs. Snooty Gotbucks want to fiddle with 20 centerpeices for her summer luncheon when she has to go get her hair and nails done?

I don't think we will ever see the demise of arranged flowers JB.

 

[CHERYL BAKIN]

JB:
Glad we can finally (maybe?) agree on something!!!!! I agree with the posting above, and I pick the same as you...
My garage is too full, and I too, too old to look for another job.

Looking at the Blumbox stuff to figure out how to do the European Hand-tied bouquets for delivery (hopefully thru our delivery pool -- NOW, THAT IS THE CHALLENGE!!)

iT'S ALL GOOD, my friend, each & everything that we say to each other moves us along.......

Regards,

Cheryl

 

[RWK]

My whole point JB - Is that you, Goldie, and others seem to want to try and beat them at their game....playing by their rules.....and I don't think you can.

BUT if you start playing their game BETTER than they do.....and playing by your rules.....and with better equipment......Then that changes things for you, for the better.

 

[RWK]

To use a baseball analogy - Which is going to have the better chance at a over the fence home run?

A cheap bat ..... wielded by a minor league rookie ( Proflowers )

or

A top of the line Louisville Slugger brand being wielded by A. Rod ( Your shop )

The old pro with still some tricks up his sleeve.....or the young whippernapper going for the gusto ?

 

[CHERYL BAKIN]

To use a baseball analogy - Which is going to have the better chance at a over the fence home run?

A cheap bat ..... wielded by a minor league rookie ( Proflowers )

or

A top of the line Louisville Slugger brand being wielded by A. Rod ( Your shop )

The old pro with still some tricks up his sleeve.....or the young whippernapper going for the gusto ?

Ricky:
You have it backwords:

PF has the Louisville Slugger -- and they are hitting the ball out of the park.

Retail florists have become the people with the cracked bats....and we are barely able to get to second base now on a good day!

JB, Goldie, Sher and I are not saying that there will never, ever be a place for arranged flowers. There will be. However, given the times and our competition, I thought that you finally agreed that we could take a page from their research playbook, and maybe, maybe just do it better than they can.

For instance, as Sher said:
We CAN offer same day delivery!
We CAN offer it unarranged...or arranged.
We CAN deliver on Saturday, Sunday or Monday.......without it costing a special delivery fee.
and so on. (my head is getting tired from all the rehash that we will never agree on......) so, I must say:

We CAN DO THIS.......IT JUST REQUIRES THAT WE ALL EXAMINE WHAT WE NOW DO, WHAT WE ARE CAPABLE OF DOING, , AND HOW WE CAN DO IT BETTER!
Cheryl

 

[CHERYL BAKIN]

Resources for all:

Giftbox.com offers the Gold window flower box that Sher mentioned above & I gave you sample pricing of.

Blumebox.com offers the cardboard stylish flower packer, in sizes ranging from 4" cubes, 6" & 8" sizes. They are colorful. YOu need to take a minimum of 25 (now) per size,......colors can be mixed.
Toll free # is 1-888-582-1094.
(We used the 6" size to deliver hand-tied bridal flowers in all last year, and it worked great!). You might want the 8" size for a European hand-tied look. The 4" cube is new (I think) to the site. Looks cute -- maybe a possibility for Secretary's Day??


Cheryl

 

[goldfish]

My whole point JB - Is that you, Goldie, and others seem to want to try and beat them at their game....playing by their rules.....and I don't think you can.

I never said that.

ProFlowers' market is the consumers who want cheap, unarranged flowers. All I'm saying is that we, too, can target this market profitably before it's completely taken away.

The question of 'how' we do it is not settled at all. Obviously, we probably can't ship boxed flowers all over the place. All we can do is to compete with ProFlowers at local level.

This thread has given a lot of seed ideas and we go from there. Some painful decisions may have to be made, but I'm actually excited. At least, we are talking about actively capturing the target, as opposed to merely complaining about a lost market.